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Add upgrade t2 shields for aeon

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Balance Discussion
aeonbalance
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  • Z
    ZetRoy @Anachronism_
    last edited by 6 Aug 2022, 19:56

    @Penguin_
    Shield radius t2 aeon 20
    Shield radius t2 seraphim 28

    Shield radius t3 aeon 35
    Shield radius t3 seraphim 46

    As you can see, the small radius is already compensated by the cheapness of the Aeon shield. The absence of an upgrade is not justified by anything.
    In narrow areas it is not always possible to put a large number of shields.

    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
    • E
      Exselsior @Tagada
      last edited by Exselsior 8 Jun 2022, 20:03 6 Aug 2022, 20:03

      @tagada Idk I think it's a buff in late team game situations for a shield that doesn't need a buff. It's a basically meaningless change in ladder, but not team games

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
      • J
        Jip @TheVVheelboy
        last edited by Jip 8 Jun 2022, 20:10 6 Aug 2022, 20:04

        @i_forgorthescene said in Add upgrade t2 shields for aeon:

        Nice forum formatting lol...

        Aeon 22,92 138/s 27s 150e 20 480
        Seraphim 18.57 153/s 28s 250e 28 700
        Uef 15.00 120/s 26s 200e 26 600
        Cybran Ed2 15.2 88/s 25s 200e 21 460
        Cybran Ed3 7.93 112/s 28s 300e 28 1260

        Needs to be a proper markdown table, you forgot the header row separating the header / the content 😉

        A work of art is never finished, merely abandoned

        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 4
        • Z
          ZetRoy
          last edited by 6 Aug 2022, 20:07

          @Exselsior
          Adding an Aeon shield upgrade does not enhance the shield's stats in any way, they remain the same.

          E 1 Reply Last reply 6 Aug 2022, 20:16 Reply Quote 0
          • E
            Exselsior @ZetRoy
            last edited by 6 Aug 2022, 20:16

            @zetroy Shield micro is usually a sweaty late team game thing, but the ability to upgrade t2 to t3 to get a fresh shield is useful, hence it's a buff in certain scenarios over having to ctrl k and rebuild the shield. Which also kinda goes back to my general point: why are you even trying to upgrade from t2 to t3 often enough that this is such a problem, especially in contexts that you don't realize that it is, in fact, a buff to be able to do so?

            Z 1 Reply Last reply 6 Aug 2022, 20:33 Reply Quote 1
            • S
              snowy801
              last edited by 6 Aug 2022, 20:17

              I think this would be a great quality of life change. Nerf it if you really must.

              E 1 Reply Last reply 6 Aug 2022, 20:19 Reply Quote 0
              • E
                Exselsior @snowy801
                last edited by 6 Aug 2022, 20:19

                @snowy801 Yeah I mean it's fine if there's a nerf and then this is added as a QOL change I guess. I kinda like the faction diversity here though. There are actually interesting tradeoffs with the different approaches to shields between the four factions.

                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                • Z
                  ZetRoy @Exselsior
                  last edited by 6 Aug 2022, 20:33

                  @Exselsior
                  The upgrade is not a critical buff and does not affect balance or shield stats in any way. The aeon shield is already balanced by the coverage radius.

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • Z
                    ZetRoy
                    last edited by 6 Aug 2022, 23:14

                    The importance of shield radius.
                    The Aeon shield at the forefront can hold 21 objects.
                    aeon_r.jpg
                    The Seraphim shield at the forefront can hold 49 objects.
                    sera_r.jpg
                    The Seraphim has twice the capacity of objects under the shield.

                    S A 2 Replies Last reply 6 Aug 2022, 23:19 Reply Quote 0
                    • S
                      SpikeyNoob Global Moderator @ZetRoy
                      last edited by 6 Aug 2022, 23:19

                      @zetroy I have not read this whole thread so i offer no opinion. i just want to point out that bigger shields take much more damage since they cover more area. So its harder to miss the shield bubble and the shield will go down quicker since more is under it.

                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • A
                        archsimkat @ZetRoy
                        last edited by 7 Aug 2022, 07:57

                        @zetroy I think that if you're trying to argue that aeon t2 shields are bad because a single 480 mass shield can only cover 11,088 mass of t2 pd, you're using them wrong...

                        Z 1 Reply Last reply 7 Aug 2022, 09:17 Reply Quote 0
                        • W
                          wikingest
                          last edited by wikingest 8 Jul 2022, 08:43 7 Aug 2022, 08:41

                          I think it was just an example, and people usually do not spend their games filling shields with t2 pd's.
                          But if example on FAF's "chessboard" is not good, then:
                          Aeon t2 shield 20203.14=1256 superficy
                          Sera t2 shield 28283.14=2462 superficy
                          Sera one covers 1.96 times more surface. Considering space lost underneath the shield also, two Aeon shields covers less useful space than one Sera shield. And two Aeon shields cost total of 960 mass, and consume/drain 300 energy. While Sera one costs 700 and consumes/drains 250 energy. And of course you dont always have space to put small shields everywhere. Much easyer to have overlapping and "blinking " shields with bigger shields. And not so many units that can totally (and always) miss an Aeon shield bubble. I suppose t3 arty can miss it, but can also fall two times in the same place...
                          So, I would like to point out, that shield size can be huge advantage, on static as well as on mobile shields.

                          edit: calculation marks have dissapeared.? I mean 20 multiply 20 mutiply 3.14 and 28 multiply 28 multiply 3.14

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                          • Z
                            ZetRoy @archsimkat
                            last edited by ZetRoy 8 Jul 2022, 09:18 7 Aug 2022, 09:17

                            @archsimkat
                            I argue that aeon t2 shield are bad because they cannot be upgraded to t3.
                            The absence of an upgrade to t3 can in no way be the right balance for a aeon t2 shield.
                            Aeon t2 shield is balanced by the fact that it has a small radius.

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • H
                              HollowSubmarine
                              last edited by 7 Aug 2022, 09:21

                              Just curious, are the Aeon t2 shields meant to be unupgradable due to balance reasons or it's just some legacy part of the game that everyone get used to?

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • T
                                Tagada Balance Team
                                last edited by 7 Aug 2022, 09:31

                                Just some random legacy "feature"

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • C
                                  Conny_Action
                                  last edited by 7 Aug 2022, 10:50

                                  its legacy of the game bcs they balanced it and its an asymmetrical rts. different factions perform different on different maps in different phases of the game. we always have to look at the whole context of the faction. aeon got shielded t2 unit obsidian and a hover shield f e. also (i think it was mentioned) bigger shield =/= better. the aeon shield is a smaller hitbox in general, i cant do the math but you shouold look at the shield per squaremeter so to say 🍕

                                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                  • M
                                    MeowMure @Tagada
                                    last edited by 18 Apr 2023, 16:00

                                    @tagada What about adding the feauture? I totally understand that you do not care about this in 1v1 games, however in late games when t3/t4 arty is firing it is very annoying that you can not upgrade it compared to uef, sera or cybran. Adding this will not change 1v1 games but will definetely help in team games where much is decident in a late game. Thanks!

                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • Sladow-NoobS
                                      Sladow-Noob
                                      last edited by 19 Apr 2023, 09:25

                                      ctrl+k shields which were killed, replace with them a new one, problem fixed. Since you're most likely talking about Gap you have 45903450 buildpower in your base anyway the moment t3/t4 arty shoots at you.

                                      Inactive.

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • RoweyR
                                        Rowey
                                        last edited by 19 Apr 2023, 09:37

                                        the issues it its not as simple as it sounds as their is not proper upgrade animation for the T2 > T3 shield for the Aeon so that would been to be created first

                                        "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" - Spock

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                                        • Z
                                          Zwackelmann
                                          last edited by 19 Apr 2023, 11:03

                                          Im an Aeon Main, i dint think it should be changed. The Game ist meant top be asymetrical. Aeon have many Perls that other Factions dint have, and the t2 shield ist awesome. Its super cheap and sturdy. No Need to add an Upgrade Option.

                                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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