I just hate the mechanics of telemazer, it is way to overpowered. It costs only 19K mass which is cheaper than the ML which has the same dps. And now when tele got buffed to 15 seconds it is not even a one way trip, ACU almost always can tele back if there was no anti tele built before. Tele def is very expensive compared to telemazer on the maps where u have a big expansion and big air grids like in seton's clutch, for example. It is too expensive to cover all the air grid in t2 pds, and t1 pds do not make a big difference, cause u can also upgrade a gun for cybran acu and they have bigger range. U need at least 10 t2 pds to kill the acu, but they will deal an enourmous damage, like killing half of the air grid on that location. To cover all the expansion in seton for example u need at least 40-60 pds for a team, which is normally 20K-60K mass. Because it lasts only 15 seconds t1 bombers or t2 bombers are not a good option, since they are too slow to kill the acu. So it makes 30K mass to invest (minimum) or I assume even more to spend only because enemy team has Cybran in their squad. The cybran player may not even go for tele but u have to build anti tele ahead, cause there is no way to counter telemazer if u have discovered teleport when it has already begun. Just make laser generator and teleport in a co-blocking spot. PLEASE!
Telemazer - time for change?
@ftxcommando then change tele to at least 30 seconds so it really will be one way ticket. In the current situation mostly cybran acu manages to teleport quite few times in a row.
"Tele got buffed to 15s"... And then you wonder why people don't take you seriously...
My man, I have no clue what to say to you but tele got NERFED to 15s as it was 10s for years.
Also g-great idea. Making tele absolutely useless with 30s teleportation wind up.
Like really. Did you really come up with this amazing idea and thought everyone will come and clap in unison?
Btw. Strat bombers exist just like TML.
It is not a buff it is a bug which os being fixed
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The mass cost is not really relavent, as the energy cost of these upgrades is what is meant to limit its timing. Most ACU upgrades are like this.
Besides, telly mazer is only reason the laser even gets used in team games.
@gabitii How about you learn to scout, instead? The upgrade is time consuming and
very power expensive, so you'll have plenty of time to see people preparing. Add to that the fact that its a high-risk-high-reward strategy and you'll understand why you don't see the strategy used as often as you seem to imply.
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The buff from 25 seconds to 15 seconds teleport delay was on accident. In the next developers iteration this is fixed, then it is back to 25 seconds.
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Honestly the number of failed teles on me and the number of times Ive tele'd, killed everything and not gotten out suggests that tele is pretty easily countered.
Telemaser isnt just the cost of gun+laser+tele. Its also a few thousand mass of energy storage and many, many thousands of mass of PGens plus the lost factory time where you make the upgrade plus you have to try and avoid being scouted for a hot minute while you build the thing.
I looked it up. Tele takes you at best, around 5 minutes to execute and costs in the region of 2M power (and thats without actually going anywhere) and costs 19,800 mass in upgrades. You need at least 4 T3 PGens, though 6-8 is probably more where youre at to make it feasible so thats another 20k mass. A few E storage takes you up another 1-2k. And Im still not counting the scouting of a tele target, or tele-ing in.
So just to be clear youre complaining that something which takes an air grid of power, in the region of 50K mass, is easily scouted, takes minutes, deprives the enemy of minutes of air production and teleports less DPS than a spider with like 1/5th the HP into your base which deprives the enemy team of a base (or at least a player of APM) is OP?
If tele gets nerfed, then I'm going to need the spider adjusted to cost about half as much mass because for the DPS/HP, stealth etc its just completely OP.
Telemazor is OP because full share gives it near zero risk and late game the e cost is inconsequential. You are mandated to put 15 t2 pd around grid/smd/acu/game enders per player and can only cut that cost down by placing these things all right on top of each other.
@ftxcommando I agree on this, in full share u can easily kill the air grid since it is very difficult and expensive to cover air grid with anti tele, as acu has enormous dps it will manage to deliver enourmous damage to air grid and their units will live on. Like u can send one cybran acu and will win air with high probability
@indexlibrorum said in Telemazer - time for change?:
@gabitii How about you learn to scout, instead? The upgrade is time consuming and
very power expensive, so you'll have plenty of time to see people preparing. Add to that the fact that its a high-risk-high-reward strategy and you'll understand why you don't see the strategy used as often as you seem to imply.
"just scout bro" - 1300
it is not high risk, because the base is transferred to teammates. it is even lower risk on large maps, because large maps = more targets = higher odds something is undefended, lower odds of being spotted as you are teleporting, and delayed response because air units need to travel further
and as said before, it is very easy to kill the air grid, of which the damage is not quantifiable by just mass killed in pgens/air factories, but also the amount of time, attention, and apm required to rebuild the airgrid. and for this entire duration, youl'l have no/decreased air production. what do the enemies lose? an acu, and a minute of upgrading.
@thecodemander said in Telemazer - time for change?:
You need at least 4 T3 PGens, though 6-8 is probably more where youre at to make it feasible so thats another 20k mass
this is such terrible logic. what kind of player doesn't have a ton of t3 pgens lategame to begin with? when getting tele, you pause everything but tele, meaning all of the pgens you already had at that point already exist and do not need to be accounted for when calculating tele costs.
@thecodemander said in Telemazer - time for change?:
And Im still not counting the scouting of a tele target
like you wouldn't just have scouted already, because scouting is good, lol
@thecodemander said in Telemazer - time for change?:
So just to be clear youre complaining that something which takes an air grid of power
it does not, because it is a one-time upgrade. it can be done on less t3 pgens, which, again, are structures everyone has in the lategame.
Your comparison to a monkeylord makes no sense because a monkeylord does not have the ability to teleport. Losing one player worth of APM is not a big deal at all, especially in higher rated games.
Losing apm isn’t a big deal at the super late game when bases are all well developed because everything gets concentrated into a game ender of some sort anyway. There is no marginal benefits from having resources managed better as you incrementally increase eco, you just turn the ras boy factory back on or select the 10 t3 engies building mass fabs again.
The mass cost may be reasonable but the power cost hurts. As someone who telemazers often, building that energy and waiting for the upgrade is a massive opportunity cost.
Also, by it's very nature it is very high risk. High reward yes, but it's never very safe and often very challenging to get full understanding of enemy base layouts. You cannot always get spy planes over the enemy base and maybe you have no aeon eye.
Countering it is childsplay. If you are in a team game with a cybran player who is not going to be in the front then you must realise the longer the game goes then the more likely it is. So you stand your acu in water or beside your smd which will be ringed with t1 pd as standard. An smd with pd is an open invitation to telemazer it then nuke the base.
Essentially, telemazer is like nuke. You must build an smd and you must make a teledefense.
Often telemazer is a desperate last resort. It's not overpowered but just one of wide number of ways to invest mass into an acu killing opportunity.
Smd can cover a huge area, pd and shields can not. You'll need pd and shields everywhere. Play a large map with a decentralized base and you'll realize countering it is not child's play. What is child's play is clicking tele + laser upgrade and teleporting into enemy base lol
And again, no it is not high risk because your base will be transferred to a teammate.
Although seeing the 15 second teleporting was a mistake and that it's being reverted to 25 seconds is good. Based on that i dont think any more needs to be done
If someone had 20k mass and energy to spare a telemazer, wouldn't putting that mass into your own air grid be a strictly better and 100% risk-free way of winning air on Setons? I don't see how it's OP based on killing the air grid alone given that opportunity cost.
