Trying to find a use for Mercy (Janus does it better)

If the Mercy is now sub-par by design for balance, that's another matter entirely. I thought perhaps there was some edge case for using it I was not aware of.

It isn’t shit by design, but comparing it in some equivalency to janus is silly, might as well as have uef be flabbergasted stingers cant one shot flak like specters while comparing how a mercy interacts with flak compared to janus

@immortal-d said in Trying to find a use for Mercy (Janus does it better):

If the Mercy is now sub-par by design for balance, that's another matter entirely. I thought perhaps there was some edge case for using it I was not aware of.

One edge case is that the mercy can be quite strong against moving shields because of the large damage radius in combination with damage over time. When shields move around they may let the damage source slip underneath the shield and the shield generator would be destroyed almost immediately

faf elite always win

The Mercy is not supposed to be an offensive unit, but a utility unit

I would love to see mercies have a specific use again, so they don't look like a failed Janus clone. What if they do something similar to the absolver, and do large damage to shields?

I can see usecases not just on firebases, but also against those units that have shields themselves, like the harbs, obsidians, and titans, (where strong shield DOT could be really interesting). This gives you a cool utility unit that remains relevant up to and including the T3 stage.

@jip That's more luck than anything, but I appreciate the thought. Sorry, but Mercy in its' current state is not worthwhile.

I liked their original pinpoint use better. It forced proper AA to defend. it was a gamble to use.

@defiant So did I, as it really hammers in the fact you need to bring AA, but the AA didn't always shoot them down properly. Can't have such a strong unit without a functional counter.

The Mercy is going to be as much of a pain as the Fire Beetle to balance. 1-time use units need to be cost effective, but not TOO cost effective. The Mercy in its current state is... Okay. If you rush T2 air, they can be absolute terrors for a little while, but lose favor pretty quick. Great for clouds of T1 stuff. I'm not sure how this could be better without it being too good.

@tankenabard More damage on shields, so it is firmly put into the role of a tactical tool rather than a must-used snipe unit.

If mercies had 2 damage circles, a wide one that does damage over time + a small one that does damage for a longer time, that would make them more useful

They could be used to snipe buildings like T3 mexes using the small circle. They could be used to force an ACU to move (to leave an upgrade). They might even be strong against shields (if you can get the small circle damage against a shield bubble, it would eventually collapse). If it damaged reclaim over time it would be a way to deny reclaim

But units/armies could easily move around that small spot. "Just don't stand there"

Give mercies the sacrifice ability.

So here's a thought. Perhaps we must accept that a single-use unit can never be balanced across skill ranges. Scrap that design concept entirely and change Mercy into a traditional bomber which compliments the Swift Wind. The Fire Beetle would need a similar update.

@immortal-d

Perhaps we must accept that a single-use unit can never be balanced across skill ranges.

I'm not willing to grant that assumption out of hand, and remain strongly against any move such as this that reduces faction diversity.

@indexlibrorum I'm all for maintaining faction uniqueness. That said, when was the last time you saw Mercy or Fire Beetle used in a serious capacity? Something has to give.

Stormlantern used Fire Beetles in LOTS this weekend to kill Nexus, and I did see some Mercies the weekend before but I don't remember who.

In any case I think it is far too soon for another complete Mercy rework. At the very least give balance team a few more patches to tune its performance and for players to discover uses for it. Only after some time has passed is reworking it again even worth discussing.

@immortal-d said in Trying to find a use for Mercy (Janus does it better):

So here's a thought. Perhaps we must accept that a single-use unit can never be balanced across skill ranges. Scrap that design concept entirely and change Mercy into a traditional bomber which compliments the Swift Wind. The Fire Beetle would need a similar update.

Because bad players are too bad to use a unit properly the unit shouldnt exist?

I’m assuming at present it damages all units in the aoe equally; an alternative could be for it to have a damage over time equivalent of a rapid fire artillery shell - ie the impact is split into lots of small impacts covering the aoe (each with dealing damage over time for the small area around them). This would make it much stronger va shields and very large units, but no better vs acus and other small units than it currently is. It could then have a viable niche for dealing with shields without the risk of a return of the old acu snipe behaviour

@deribus I'll watch those for sure, though admitedlly I'm more interested in the Mercy than the Beetle.
@TheWheelie Nobody said anything like that. If your first response is vitrole, stop posting. Or better yet, be useful to this conversation and post some high-rated matches in which the current Mercy is used properly (and actually makes a difference).