cybran t3 navy
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T3/late navy is perfectly balanced rn, every faction has its own strengths and weaknesses, micro is the only relevant factor that decides the outcome.
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@turinturambar you do understand this replay does not prove your point? 1. while this is a 1600+ rating game both players in this pond are 1300 and 1400 respectivly, and that shows 2. thanks to the replays i watched before i know that he missplayed navy, uef dont build theyre bs until they won the pond, they almost exclusively build battlecruisers and spam 3. the pond is a 2 vs 1, by the time hte navy figth actually starts both players in the pond double the eco of the uef player. the top pond even shows my point: pink gets t3 cybran navy and starts building frigates out of it and nothing else, despite having multiple t3 factories and an HQ.
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@lorem_ipsum What are you talking about UEF doesn't build their BS until navy is won? That could not be more incorrect, battlecruisers do not replace battleships except in specific situations. One being that you're vs a cybran player who's only making frigs, and even then it's not a replacement as they fill different roles.
And yes, you build a lot of frigs as any faction on navy, it's absolutely correct to build frigs from multiple t3 factories and if you're not doing that you're not playing it correctly regardless of the faction. Especially if you're playing cybran, frigs are 100% a big part of their t3 navy strength, it's just how navy balance works and is different from air and land balance.
Edit: Different as in on land you don't build t1 tanks at the t3 stage, and on air you don't build inties when there are asf out. Obviously this isn't a hard and fast rule and there are probably exceptions, but never to the extent that frigs are used late game.
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He speaks the truth, turin gave the dumbest replay possible to prove t3 cybran's navy worth
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I might have a good replay or two but won't be able to check until later
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@haachamachama what is cybrans strength ?
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They have the most OP unit in the game (Cyb frig) and stealth, also everything is cheaper and has less bt iirc, so you can easily overwhelm your enemy with proper scaling, for example by the time ur enemy has 3 UEF bs you're likely gonna have 8-10.
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@Haachamachama i see the frigates and see how they scale since theyre low hp dosent matter when they get overkilled anyway but having more bs is hardly an advantage when the opponent has battlecruiser ontop of his bs and those things have almost double the dps of any bs are cheaper and the low hp can be offset by shieldboats and the low range of em gets kinda offset by beeing even faster then the omen
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I play nothing but UEF. I can tell you that BCs do not trade well with any BS in the game. They have half the hp with less range, they will be killed and result in a snowball naval loss.
UEF BC -> kill anything not a BS
UEF BS -> kill enemy BS -
@lorem_ipsum said in cybran t3 navy:
@Haachamachama i see the frigates and see how they scale since theyre low hp dosent matter when they get overkilled anyway but having more bs is hardly an advantage when the opponent has battlecruiser ontop of his bs and those things have almost double the dps of any bs are cheaper and the low hp can be offset by shieldboats and the low range of em gets kinda offset by beeing even faster then the omen
Just no. You have many 2k+ players here experts in navy telling you how it really is, don't dig deeper now
Saying you'd rather have the 7k mass costing unit with 25k hp and shorter range, than the 8k mass costing unit with longer range and almost 20k HP more???
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@ftxcommando @Haachamachama i now tested battlecuiser(bc from now on) with 1 shieldboat, under the conditions that the bc with the shieldboat have to close in to a broadside position bs, the bc only closes in enougth to use its main weapons, not its torpedos(20dps) both units were unmicroed aside from stopping the shieldboat from hiding behind the bc, plays out as follows: when the battleship does not kill the shieldboat first it blinks up a second time makeing the bc win any matchup. when the battleship targets the shieldboat first the results are as follows: cybran bs loses 1.6k hp left on bc(8k mass bs vs 8.3k of bc and shieldboat), aoen bs won 3.3k hp left (9k mass vs 8.3k), seraphim bs won 2.8k hp left [in this test a volley of the bs hit both the bc and the shieldboat but i didnt wanna redo, it just shows how close this is](9k mass vs 8.3k), uef bs wins 4.8k hp left (10k mass vs 8.3k).
this test is setup in a way to give the bs every feasible advantage in a direct comparison(full dps from the start, range advantage and even cost advantage aside from cybran), ontop of that any micro will benefit the bc since its guns cant miss while its realistic that the faster smaller bc can doge some projectiles since all the bs have relatively slow ones. make of this info as you will but to say that bc+shieldboat get beat consistently by any bs is straigth up not true.edit: anyone is free to repeat this test and counter my results but your "experience" is more biased then any test i can make
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I mean the results of a bunch of 2ks playing matters more than sandboxing imo
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@lorem_ipsum So the Cybran bs lost vs a greater mass force with zero micro? This isn’t the argument you think it is, especially since once the bs is in range you kite back with it getting a lot of free shots before the faster bc catches up. Not to mention you’d use frigs as meat shields in practice anyway, and they’d kill the shield boats. Or t2 subs will kill the shield boats.
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@spikeynoob didnt say it doesn't not matter, i said it is more biased since experience is litterally bias, so i implore you, just test it out in your games and tell me again that using this to your advantage wont work out for you. i have watched replays and seen it work out for players that is why im making this case.
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@exselsior you can also assume that one player has more eco and a second shieldboat or more frigates, realism is not the point of a modeled test, it is to isolate a interaction. also to actually answer your criticism: a cybran frigate is 250 mass and gets killed before it can fire on anything by the bc before the bc cant fire on the bs meaning it will litterally not have an impact in this comp
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So, when do we get the down vote button back?
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@lorem_ipsum wait so why does the bs not get a stealth boat? With that the bs can easily just micro around the bc killing it without any damage taken.
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@randomwheelchair hey so far ive gotten, "my experience is worth more then your math or tests", "your opinion is invalid", and didnt get a single replay, test or video to disprove my claims so im kinda chilling...
