Weekly Discussion #19 - T1 tanks

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Well, I admit defeat and will start grabbing the low-hanging fruit.

What are your thoughts on the various T1 tanks (and Mantis) and how they affect the way each faction approaches T1 land?

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They're kind of boring but the high speed of the Mantis vs the unique range of the Aurora makes cybran v aeon ladder matches really interesting and volatile

put the xbox units in the game pls u_u

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It's interesting enough to be fun, but bland enough to be what you expect. T1 shouldn't be too wild yet. Early hover units make things interesting for sure. The balance of stats between a factions tank and light assault unit is interesting.

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Aeon t1 tank is much weaker than others. Slight range advantage does not compensate for having almost two times less hp. It is more visible in big open map in 1v1, and less visible when holding tight corridor. But even there, they can have problems (for example against cheaper and longer range t1 arty).

"and how they affect the way each faction approaches T1 land?"

Well, I think it is one of the main reasons, why people dont play Aeon (or play so much less than other nations).
https://kazbek.github.io/FAF-Analytics/ladder
edit: On top right side, there are numbers of games by faction.

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The fact that aeon t1 tanks outrange a commander is so annoying and then theres that fact that aeon gun com outranges other gun coms, but t1 aeon is a love hate thing if you have the apm to micro them they are op but if you dont watch them they are weak af, i would prefer that aeon have normal range with the same hp but have much better dps.

also the hover movment to me is abit awkward, i gave a movement order to retreat and they actualy moved farward like wtf gg

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@Caliber Yes, there is other differencys between factions.
Yes, Aeon t1 tanks are slower and dont move the same (althought they can go on water).
No, even if you have apm, Auroras are still bad in most cases. By the way, otherways high rated players would use them all the time in tournaments.

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Aurora are pretty good if you know what you are doing, they are always gonna be worse at raiding tho

The embodiment of depression...

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Hover on T1 units is a little strong. In my opinion, it should've been limited to T2 and T3.
But, I digress - It does make for some interesting plays earlier.


~ Stryker

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

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Aurora are too much of a headache for me so I usually just try and skip the T1 tank phase if I'm Aeon (in TMM)

M27AI developer; Devlog and more general AI development guide:
https://forum.faforever.com/topic/2373/ai-development-guide-and-m27ai-v66-devlog

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Auroras are like snipers. I put some flares (about 7 flares for every 5 aurora) in my armies to soak up damage and to hurt anything that tries to rush them. They're dirt cheap so who cares when they die - at least the aurora wasn't hit. When combined with an attack-move order the auroras will often survive to fight another day while the flares will take the biggest chunk of the damage.

Mantises are like an enveloping swarm - they're good for punishing an enemy who over extends, they can cut off reinforcements and hit the artillery from the side - they're good for flanking and kiting - if you have 5 mantises shooting 3 strikers, the mantis should trade favorably even if there's 15 strikers behind them. Ebb and flow like waves on the shore, draw them out and strike when they're weak and disorganized.

Strikers are like a clenched fist - they can punch straight through any enemy line and march right through to the artillery. They can be an impassible wall or a spear thrust through the gut - they are indomitable. And slow. And short range. And easily outmaneuvered / kited. They are best launched like a bullet from a gun, straight for the heart of your foe.

I don't play aliens so idk about the Thaam

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@gabrilend said in Weekly Discussion #19 - T1 tanks:

They're dirt cheap so who cares when they die

But a flare is 78% of the cost of an aurora with 74% of the hp.

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@thomashiatt

Yes but you can build them twice as fast and they deal 2/3rd as much damage. So especially when you're going against strikers, with their slow-as-heck fire rate often it's better to have two guns pointed at the enemy than one.

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yeah thomas get lectured buddy

profile picture credits to petric

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@bulliednoob I literally never see anyone else doing that so it's probably just a noob trap that I fell for lol don't listen to me xD

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The aurora is the single reason why I feel like my Aeon rating is 300 points lower than all other factions.

It can't raid, can't defend against raids on even slightly open maps, and commits suicide the moment a bomber shows up.
This disadvantage in the t1 stage snowballs into less mapcontrol, less mexes, and eventually weaker at all following tech stages.

I feel like particulary aeon vs cybran on something like a 15x15 land map is an impossible task.

I hate the aurora.

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We could make Flares a bit more like Mantises.

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I treat Aeon as substantially different in terms of army composition to UEF and Cybran. Both of them their medium tank is the star of the show, while with Aeon it's a little more mixed. Aeon has a problem with durability, so I throw in Flares to soak up some of the shots fired - this doesn't work as well against Cybran who have rapid fire laser guns on their mantises. Basically trying to get as much of the enemy's dps wasted on overkill as possible, while also dealing a ton of damage of your own. The Auroras are like archers, they're weak but they can hit from far away - the flares are like daggers. Maybe a little dull daggers, because of the shape of their projectile LOL

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I always found the Flare to be interesting. It's pretty beefy for a LAB, nice burst for ghetto gunships, but a full Aurora isn't that much more expensive.

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Mixing flares and auroras defeats the strength of either unit. It’s not a good idea for the same reason mixing mongoose and pillar is not a good idea, to properly make use of the units in a mix you’re basically required to spend 90% of your apm on your army and then while you might get slightly efficient trades your macro is so awful that you’re behind in twice the units.

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Yeah that tends to happen to me, I figured it was the Aeon curse