Thoughts on the lots games and balance implications?

[Tomma]

Who knew 1v1 games see less indirect fire units and snipers, and snipes are more pronounced.

[IndexLibrorum]

I have some thoughts.

Gods help us all.

T2 and T3 navy are too good. They scale much better than air and hover.

I am shocked to the core by the revelation that a unit which is specialized for a specific role and is an order of magnitude more expensive, beats units that are cheaper and are essentially trespassing. Shocked.

Snipes are a bit too strong. Perhaps, when an ACU hits 0 hp, it falls to the ground and becomes a crippled ACU. Crippled ACU cannot move, shoot, build, regen, or be repaired, but can absorb another 10k or 20k before it goes nuclear. Just an idea.

The ramblings of the clinically insane.

That's without considering the fact that balancing the game around the experience and playstyle of pro-players is quite possibly the worst way to go at it, for obvious reasons.

[Zeldafanboy]

We have to stop anti snipe ideology. There’s tons of rts games where you don’t have a commander unit avatar! Go play those

[Noble_Ice]

the game will be generally good balanced when our balance despots stop favoring uef and when they get in their head mobility of kennels and novax satelite is to much good

[Zeldafanboy]

UEF isn’t even that strong nor are kennels and novax their strong suits

[FtXCommando]

everyone downvoting a young man asking for discussion on lots games

[Noble_Ice]

@zeldafanboy the we dont play the same team games

[Zeldafanboy]

@noble_ice

Map issue

[FunkOff]

@ftxcommando I'm really just asking what other people thought of the balance as depicted in the highest tier games. How dare I

[phong]

@FunkOff I agree balance is in a good place right now overall. I'm wondering if your thoughts on indirect fire land units and snipers might have something to do with the balance having to cater both to 1v1 and to team games? I feel like the latter has become more important, especially since tmm is a thing.

Is it possible these units are decently balanced, but more catered to team play? They generally require more micro, I think, so maybe that's why people choose to forego them in 1v1?

[CaptainKlutz]

Snipers and mobile artillery are relatively weak on 1v1 as the fronts are normally very fluid and convex, whereas on large team games, especially on maps such as Arrakis, the fronts are very straight and you are protected on either side by either another team mate or the map border. Snipers excel in these team games as the flat frontline means their main weakness, flanking, isn't as viable a counter, as most people are just concerned about winning against their opponent slot versus winning a slot for a teammate.

Sniping ACUs is always controversial but it honestly lends so much tactical variety to FAF that it's become a defining feature that the ACU should be vulnerable for the whole game rather than an issue to be fixed. It allows whole new fields of skill expression: to both position your ACU well to avoid being sniped, and also to recognise when your opponent is vulnerable to being sniped. Without it, you get games like StarCraft 2, where games are mostly decided by unit clump positioning and numbers, as those are the only metrics that matter.

[TankenAbard]

I really only use T2 stationary artillery and T3 snipers and mobile artillery to establish a perimeter. They do fair damage and can provoke a fight, but if you can't win the fight because you don't have enough units that directly engage, then its a loss.

Sniping commanders is fine, I don't see a problem with it. Related, I don't think people scout enough.

I agree, T2 and T3 navy is absolutely horrifying if it spirals out of control. There are ways to deal with it as any faction, some work better than others. Cybran and Aeon have some interesting options. Bricks have torpedo tubes and defense flares as well as high HP, they chew slowly but they're hard to get rid of if you can sneak them into the water. The Solice can survive long enough to drop a gnarly payload, but god forbid the ships are too close to the coast, the bomber will drop its bombs into the ground and be worthless. The UEF and Seraphim are odd, the Othuum has a torpedo tube but not great HP or defensive measures. UEF are kinda stuck in a bad place because some of the better options are costly, like a Novax center or a a million T2 torpedo bombers like everyone else can do.

[Arran]

@FunkOff

I concur that balance at the moment is amazing. Almost all aspects of faf are steadily being improved upon in a healthy direction.
Snipers are like easy mode T3 mobile Arty. Obviously they will do well. Personally I would love to see snipers get a range buff and a massive move speed nerf, and probably a slight dps nerf too. Make them feel more like snipers you know, rather than just long range paper T3 percivals?

As for navy... Its strong. But isn't that the point? Since most maps, the choice to go navy is often a binary yes/no, it can easily feel like navy is too strong. However that's the mappers fault, not the balance team. With winding streams, navy sucks, not enough mobility. With high shore cliffs, navy also sucks at touching land for quite a while. Conversely, on open oceans where water is 90% of the map, navy is the strongest. It really depends on the map/mapper, rather than the unit stats when it comes to navy vs land comparisons.

[Karl-]

@indexlibrorum wait a minute isnt the whole point of the balance team that they are pros and arguing for the balance changes from the top looking down