@Salz the only thing that would satisfy me from all of this would be an actual active program developed to doing something about the Novax involving the people that would actually have to do it me not being one of them because I agree with you something dramatic needs to be changed not just cost changes.
My only point in making this article was to try and spurn that change not to get any specific result because it does seem like the majority of players have a problem with the unit as is.
@FtXCommando said in Another Novax conversation:
I’d probably aim for making its combat aspect revolve around being a support tool. Have it have the ability to stun either land or air units under it as some EMP satellite. Introduce the ability to make units move slower as the satellite disrupts communication in its area with the ACU. Mobile shields no longer work. Who knows.
That actually seems pretty good IMO...if it stunned a pgen and turned it off rather than killing it and causing a chain reaction...I think the EMP effect makes the most sense but I have a 1.2k brain so anything seems good to me lol
@TheWeakie I'm not aware of exact stats I'm just working from a conceptual point of view so yeah I may have exaggerated the comparison but my point is the same.
I guess we just always get back to having to deal with what the Novax is and move on? Why is it even in the game? Is it strictly due to lore? What about just removing it all together?
I dont know. Same result as any Novax conversation lol
@FtXCommando Traditionally speaking intel has been a major aspect of what the airforce does so it makes sense. You're probably right nobody will pay that much mass for intel very often and so reducing its costs seems like a good idea but then it begs the question what is the point in the Novax at all...right back to where we are now lol.
I think that this just highlights how unique the Novax is in comparison to any other unit in the game. Imagine if the Soothsayer had a monkeylord laser on top of it that could target anything in its visual radius and cost 30k mass. That is what the Novax is except it can fly anywhere and never really be targeted or countered.
Maybe reclassifying it is the solution which I guess is a complicated thing when you consider all factors.
It doesnt seem like there is any real good idea to try in alpha/beta testing so its just left as is.
I am curious FTX what do you think the optimal solution is for the Novax if nothing was off the table?
@FtXCommando You are probably right when you consider it from a pro level only perspective but the real world I speak of most players do not care about actual cost and being hyper efficient, they care about value and what they get out of something.
As I have said a forum post (at least not this one) is no place to decide on the actual stats this will have. I'm trying to achieve high level (in business high level means low detail) discussions to try and affect change but since we are talking about it.
Referring to the novax as t4 air is extremely inaccurate IMO and shouldn't be compared to the other t4 air units.
An eye is fairly cheap but requires alot of micro to be effective and has a small intel radius.
Soothsayer is very effective with its large intel radius but is static and easy to kill.
A novax is invincible and can move. If that isnt the t4 version of the previous 2 than I dont know what is.
If we are going to compare the novax to the soothsayer and eye lets not try to also call it an air unit.
@FtXCommando I can see what you are saying but in the real world most players don't care about cost they care about value and when a team cant see anything to target then paying a premium for t4 intel would be incredibly valuable to them regardless of cost.
If the side affect is that nobody really makes Novax anymore than I think FAF players would be just fine with that but I am certain that players would still build it because they want to see. Yeah its like 100 spy planes but it can never be shot down. There are points in many games where you literally need 100 spy planes in order to get your 5 seconds of intel. Novax basically removes the fog of war which again, in my opinion is extremely OP and should cost a lot and shouldn't be built often.
I disagree. I was playing a game yesterday where I had 2 arty but our team did not have eye tech and the sam/asf wall made scouting nearly impossible. My teammate made 1 novax and we went around target for target to end the game. The laser was not what I needed for my arty, it was the unlimited uninterrupted intel that I needed and I would have gladly paid T4 prices at that point in the game to have it so, no I personally do not think that paying 30k+ for unlimited intel is overpriced. An invincible omni scout that can be positioned anywhere and basically never be killed or countered is extremely OP and worth paying a high cost for at certain stages in the game.
@magge I thought I had solved the issue as I believed it was related to specific icon mods but after trying others I got the same thing. Random system freeze when zooming in and out.
I crashed in this game at 34:11 and the debugger should be enabled.game_24590253.log
@Nuggets I dont disagree. My 1200 brain likes the chaos of the idea more than anything I guess because at least its not what we have now lol. In any case I guess when I started this post it was to try and spurn the conversation for change. I made this post right after a game where the effect of what Snoog mentioned earked me.
Our team was winning on all fronts despite them having arty and us not. We see 1 Novax Sat coming our way and our entire team has to stop and spam sheilds and power meaning the advantage we were actively pressing got put on hold. We could no longer replace units on the front as fast as before because we were spending on novax defense and, I beleive was the clear reason we lost the game...1 single novax that didnt really kill anything important.
Every Novax thread has alot of ideas and heart but they all seem to have one thing in common. Enough people hate it that it should be changed and so I guess I am wondering what it takes to have the actual decision makers work the problem and implement anything.
Easy for me to say because I don't have to worry about it much beyond this thread.
I truly believe that allowing them to target each other is the best place to start. Why doesn't FAF take a year and make quarterly adjustments to see what the community prefers. 3 months of allowing Novax to target each other then 3 months of novax costing less but no laser and so on? I think the ultimate solution is allowing them to target each other but it can only be known if we try. Same as many suggestions. I also think that perhaps FAF just allow Novax to be unit restricted but still allow for a ranked match would be an interesting idea too. Whats a year of live "beta testing" to see what works. A year is nothing anymore lol
Clearly there would have to be an adjustment to the cost of it because that 36k includes the laser, I try not to state the obvious when I'm speaking.
One thing is for sure. It seems pretty clear that it needs a rework. Been a hot topic for the 6 years I've been playing and nothing's been done about it.
@Nuggets I don't see how it would be any less dumb to build than an Eye. Novax without It's attack function is still very op in my opinion. An indestructible scout that can just hang out over a front line with an attacking Army or full Intel on your opponent's base forever. It's an insanely strong asset even without the laser.
How about we disable the laser function for a year and see how it plays out. What does it take for the balance team to decide to action something like this?
@Caliber I just think those are extremely rare cases that just have to be dealt with. If one person develops a reputation for that then they probably find it harder to get into a lobby...or they get in and people purposely rush them to teach them a lesson but its just super rare.....no different than in an actual combat scenario if you lose a major asset early you still have to fight the battle. Its not suppose to be easy.
@IndexLibrorum I agree its skill issue. I like to play air a lot in 1.2k+ games meaning I am the low rank on my team and I find it so funny when higher ranks are insulting and blaming me for getting sniped or for their army getting destroyed by air meanwhile they have ZERO flak of any kind 15+ mins into the game...I swear the first t4 of every game gets sent in with no scouts or flak and gets sniped by gunships in the enemy base and they blame me for not defending it lol.
I am a career 1.3k type player but that doesn't mean I cant recognize how many higher ranked players have serious skill issues over simple things lol.
I personally dont think t2 air snipes are an issue. There are always those random players who do it but overall players would rather use their air advantage taking out eco. Snipes do have their place and should never be nerfed imo. If your front is being pushed hard with enemy acus then sniping one of them can sure take the pressure off even if it does hand a nice base to their higher ranked player...one problem at a time.
If you get an acu drop in your base you will sure be happy that t2 air kills acus....because if t2 air is nerfed then I will probably acu drop every single game from now on...will be fun.
So lets make one thing clear. I dont really care if anything changes with the novax (or any other unit for that matter)
I was trying to fall asleep last night and was thinking about FAF because I am a complete loser with no life.
For some reason a thought entered my brain and the half asleep sad version of myself thought it was a good idea so I'm going to present it here because I have seen so many tears about the Novax since I have been playing FAF
The common argument seems to be that the Novax is unbalanced and has no counter.
My suggestion is simple. Give the satellites the capability to target each other.
Novax is suppose to be a defensive unit (based on its name) and this change I believe would allow it to function more like that.
I believe this change would force players into winning an advantage before they can punish their opponent.
Land, Sea, Air all require an advantage to be won as battles must be fought and won before you can start to punish your opponent so this would mean that you would have to win a Novax battle in order to be able to abuse them over enemy battle space.
If you make a Novax you would have to decide if sending it to your opponents base is the right move knowing that you can be shot down having to re build a satellite in the ground station.
If you were under siege by say 4-5 Novax then you could start making your own under shield cover and send them over to enemy battlespace (knowing you couldn't keep them in your base as they'd be shot down being outnumbered)
Now the enemy has to decide to send their satellites back to their base to engage the sats you are sending or not.
If this is considered than I would recommend that sats are not able to fire or be targeted until they reach altitude so that they cant be insta killed as they ascend to orbit from the ground station.
Pretty much any in game scenario I can think of where Novax are used seems to have a simple resolution if Novax can target each other and the more I think of it the more intriguing the scenarios seem to be with this adjustment.
If this is a bad ide it wont hurt my feelings. So many times ideas seem so great until they are subjected to peer review so thats the point here.
thanks I never even saw that was an option.
I just crashed again now for same reasons. I was dead but watching the match and the game froze as i was zooming in and then back out again. It happened at 14:00 exactly for me.game_24520703.log
Install the mod "Hover over deposits"
Welcome back to FAF!!!
Ok, I may not be as dumb as I think I am. but when I paste the log I get an error as it exceeds the character limit of the forum. How else do I share?
Yeah...that may seem like a simple task...but I need someone who can tell me where that game log is. You mean replay id?