Seton's Clutch Tournament Best team of 2023
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@syndicus said in Seton's Clutch Tournament Best team of 2023:
@deli I don't think so to be completely honest. I think when you hit 2K, you've hit a barrier of how much skill is possessed by that player. Of course this is subjective to what types of maps are played (Ex. 2K dual gapper vs 2K TMM player). It isn't as dramatic until you reach like 2500 because in that regard, in order to have possessed that many points, that player would have had to win multiple games against other 2Ks to be able to gain points going past, which would show superior skill. As you may know there are not as many players that achieve 2500. I think allowing 2100,2200,2300 to be considered 2000 is fine.
In my opinion, as 2000 global, there is quite a lot of difference between 1900-2100/(some 2.2ks) and players that are 2300+.
It's similar to the difference between 1800 players and 2000. There are exceptions though since you have overrated and underrated players. But generally speaking, this holds somewhat true.
It seems daft to cap and define 2000+ players as just 2000 players. By your own admission, a player who hits 2000 has hit the ultimate ability and skill possible in the game, which is not true. As you also point out, if a player manages to acquire 2500 rating, they have broken your previous assumption about skill caps. And assuming that said 2500 has acquired such a rating via beating 2000 rated players is wrong. Take the player Sid as an example. Or my clanmate Leader with 3600 global rating. He did not achieve such a rating by slaughtering hordes of 2300-2600 rated players.
These are of course exceptions.
I don't think it's fine to consider 2100, 2200, 2300, 2400 and 2500 rated players as 2000 players. Some players of those ratings may in fact be closer to 2000 ability in reality, but when you get to 2200 and certainly 2300 and above they are most definitely not like 2000 players.
It should be fine to include these players of 2100+ rating with their actual displayed global ratings. It just means their teammates will be of somewhat lower quality when making up the 6600 team skill ceiling.
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The point of the rating ceiling in prior tournaments was to enable a high level tournament without having it simply be combining 2 of the top 5 as the winning team. Since 1800+ is the general level where everyone is familiar with everyone else for general games, the intent was to have a rating cap that stops Yudi and Farm from being, for example, an autowin 2v2 team yet not forcing them to partner with a random 1500 they have no experience with because that isn’t the type of player commonly played with at that level. So for 2v2 we had a 4100 rating cap with people maxing out at like 2200 rating as a ceiling. This was doing something like saying bully equates to yudi/farm in a 2v2. This enabled farm/tagada/yudi to play with a 1700-1800 rather than a 1500-1600 at the time.
This tournament, however, is saying briang equates to yudi/farm. Likewise it doesn’t actually stop any autowin since farm/yudi could still play along with a random 1700-1800 they are familiar with and have an 800 that has the objective of dying in mid. Really both the 1800 and 800 can play aggressive in mid with the intent to die and let the other two inherit the base. IIRC this was basically the general gameplan during the last tournament from Yudi’s team.
The rating minimum does more for halting autowin stacks; I’d probably even move it up since 800s in a tournament is just asking for immediate base donations. But the rating ceiling doesn’t do much because in the end, the rating cap is too small to enable people to play with largely familiar players.
That’s my take on it anyway.
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If you want to promote diverse teams, I would suggest - every team needs to fit into one of these two rating caps:
Player 1: Unlimited rating
Player 2: up to 2000 rating max
Player 3: up to 1800 rating max
Player 4: up to 1600 rating maxor
Player 1: 2100 max
Player 2: 2000 max
Player 3: 1900 max
Player 4: 1800 maxThe first kind of cap would allow JT and Mizer and Syndicus to be on competitive teams with the highest-rated players, without having a Yudi + Foley type of stack. (Allowing a Yudi + Foley on the same team would ruin the tournament by making only 1 team viable to win). The second kind of cap would allow other high-rated players to be competitive against a team led by Yudi or Foley.
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Not sure how the game would play out, myself, but what if the 800 draws the air slot? Player walks mid after building fac and com bombs?
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@cortana said in Seton's Clutch Tournament Best team of 2023:
In my opinion, as 2000 global, there is quite a lot of difference between 1900-2100/(some 2.2ks) and players that are 2300+.
Seconding this. Most of the >2.3k players are just significantly better than me at my 2k.
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sign up fedorafreak (1500) for Team Friendship-And-Gaming, if Mize the legend will take me.
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@Cortana @FtXCommando @CheeseBerry Thanks for your inputs for the tournament. I think I now have a more general understanding of what is to be adjusted here. I have adjusted the minimum rating to be 1000 rating and have adjusted the ceiling to be 2300 rating. If you have any ideas on or changes for what I adjusted please send me your suggestions.
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@syndicus The way you phrased the rating cap it sounds like >2.3k players are forbidden from joining. I assume you intended it to mean that >2.3k players will be counted as 2300 for the purposes of total team rating, right?
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I can somewhat sign up? 2000 currently, if a team needs me contact me via Discord. I'm not a Setoner and therefore I'm prob more of a 1800.
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Sign up. Im think my 2100 perfectly fit in to Mizer's team.
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I would like to participate but what time frame needs to be reserved for this on that day?
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Sign up
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Is the optimal balance rule set in stone?
This will likely create some unbalanced games. Ideally, you want the strongest team members to be on the carry slots, i.e. rock and air so each team has their best chance of winning. Leaving it to random chance isn't good. For example, what if one team has their carry players on the weakest slots, whilst the other team has their carry players on the carry slots. That's an inherent random disadvantage for one team and is generally not good for the tournament as a whole.
Teams should therefore be able to collaborate amongst themselves on who will take up which slots
Many Thanks
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Wait how is opti supposed to work in this, you can't have premade teams with opti. Am I missing something there?
Also when is the deadline to signup? I'm still trying to figure out my life to make sure I can be free to play.
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@exselsior said in Seton's Clutch Tournament Best team of 2023:
Wait how is opti supposed to work in this, you can't have premade teams with opti. Am I missing something there?
Also when is the deadline to signup? I'm still trying to figure out my life to make sure I can be free to play.
Actually yeah, I didn't even realise this lol. Optimal balance wouldn't even work for premade teams. So it has to be manual balance of course.
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@exselsior
It cant be Opti. I'd luv to see you there Sir -
You can in theory do optimal balance by having the TD randomly generate map orders where you put highest rated at 1 and lowest rated at 4
Optimal balance is way better because otherwise you just tell mid and beach to die in mid with mega brutal carry gamers playing rock and air
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@cheeseberry Correct, players 2300 rating and below will be allowed to sign up.
Suffer in silence
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@syndicus sign up (in Cortana team)
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sign up
