Why would you have left FAF?

veteranashe

You clearly haven't seen the princess bride then

Brutus5000

@nflanders said in Why would you have left FAF?:

I really want FAF to become a commercial project... It's a pity that these are just dreams.....
Although there may be a chance that IP SupCom now belongs to Embracer Group. A Nordic Games is a subsidiary of Embracer Group and publisher of SC:FA.
You could ask them for money in exchange for some obligations. @Deribus as you wrote, you would find use for additional funds.
Perhaps there are good negotiators in the FAF structure... Past negotiations with Nordic Games were, in my opinion, extremely mediocre...

This is the opposite of what all contributors I know want. We have made FAF a non-commercial project on purpose, to make sure it can be free forever and not steered by commercial interests. Thus we also decided a long time ago to not get any commercial funding from ads, campaigns or whatsoever. If you make it a commercial project you will probably loose 75% or more of the volunteers on the project.

Nex

@broker said in Why would you have left FAF?:

you are not interested in any proposals other than your own.

Nobody in this thread is interested in any kind of proposal.
This is the "why you left?" thread and not the "what would you do to make it better?" thread.

Players are very good at telling you why they don't like your game, but they are notoriously bad at making it better.
That's general game developer advice. "Listen to your players complaints, but not their advice"

There might be some good advice mixed in there sure, but in general it's not helpful and will either make the game only better for that one single player or even make it worse for everyone.

@broker said in Why would you have left FAF?:

I'm sure that if I go into the game in five years, nothing will change.
I think you'll like it.
but others get bored.

that's just a type of player this game is not trying to attract.
Chess also didn't change for a few years already and people are still playing it.

FtXCommando

I actually never like that example because the game rules of chess itself might not change, but the game still moves forward through externalities. A simple one is just the introduction of bullet chess or ultrabullet. You kinda can't play those sort of time controls over the board, and these days I'd wager there are WAY more blitz and bullet casual chess fans than classical time control enjoyers.

Nex

@ftxcommando I'd say those new gamemodes are compareable to FAF maps maybe?
And also FAF rules change so it's an unfair comparison anyway.
But that makes FAF still an upgrade from chess so

FtXCommando

Hard to say what it would compare to, my gut feeling was something closer to having prebuilt bases in ladder games or something to get rid of the early downtime.

nflanders

@brutus5000 said in [Why would you have left FAF?]

it can be free forever

If everything is free, how can my friend and I try your project for free? A friend has seen enough of Yuri’s video and wants to try playing FAF, but to do this he needs to pay 5 times more than the game costs to an intermediary who will buy him this game since it is not sold in Russia. And spend a lot of time searching for an intermediary and corresponding with him (I bought the game 15 years ago and played on GPGnet)
We play, but only in ~~GAF~~, there is no other option.

For us ordinary players, it doesn’t matter whether you are a commercial or non-profit organization, we still have to pay and it doesn’t matter to whom, the fact is that access to the FAF project is paid.

If I have to make a choice, I would rather FAF become a commercial organization and SC:FA become completely free on Steam.

clyf

@nflanders

Free as in speech, not beer.

Exselsior

@nflanders said in Why would you have left FAF?:

@brutus5000 said in [Why would you have left FAF?]

it can be free forever

If everything is free, how can my friend and I try your project for free? A friend has seen enough of Yuri’s video and wants to try playing FAF, but to do this he needs to pay 5 times more than the game costs to an intermediary who will buy him this game since it is not sold in Russia. And spend a lot of time searching for an intermediary and corresponding with him (I bought the game 15 years ago and played on GPGnet)
We play, but only in ~~GAF~~, there is no other option.

For us ordinary players, it doesn’t matter whether you are a commercial or non-profit organization, we still have to pay and it doesn’t matter to whom, the fact is that access to the FAF project is paid.

FAF is a community run project. You can technically use the client without having supreme commander installed. They're entirely separate entities. Blame your government for the increased cost to getting games on Steam.

If I have to make a choice, I would rather FAF become a commercial organization and SC:FA become completely free on Steam.

Well, I'm glad it's not up to you then. FAF would die if it became commercialized and cost money to use. No one would accept being forced to pay some fee for a small online community for a 16 year old game. I've donated hundreds by this point to FAF but I wouldn't pay if it was forced, and I'd guess I'm not alone on that.

Edit: Also, that's quite literally impossible for FAF to do since SC:FA isn't owed by FAF. We have zero control over SC:FA Steam or GOG price, but we require a proper purchase as legal protection for the FAF organization.

Brutus5000

@nflanders said in Why would you have left FAF?:

@brutus5000 said in [Why would you have left FAF?]

it can be free forever

If everything is free, how can my friend and I try your project for free? A friend has seen enough of Yuri’s video and wants to try playing FAF, but to do this he needs to pay 5 times more than the game costs to an intermediary who will buy him this game since it is not sold in Russia. And spend a lot of time searching for an intermediary and corresponding with him (I bought the game 15 years ago and played on GPGnet)
We play, but only in ~~GAF~~, there is no other option.

For us ordinary players, it doesn’t matter whether you are a commercial or non-profit organization, we still have to pay and it doesn’t matter to whom, the fact is that access to the FAF project is paid.

If I have to make a choice, I would rather FAF become a commercial organization and SC:FA become completely free on Steam.

You can play in GAF, because they give a shit about copyright law and they people running it live in a country where they probably won't be sued for violating copyright law of a "western" company. This doesn't apply to anybody living in Europe or North America.

So players are required to pay the game which on sale costs like 2€ while all other games compared cost a lot more. Sucks, but what is the alternative?

a) Run your own copy of FAF and go the risk yourself. You can do this. This is exactly how GAF works.
b) Collect millions from other people to buy the game rights. But WHY would anybody do this without expecting a return on invest? Be it getting annoyed with ads until the end of the universe or dumbing the game down to reach wider audience or whatever. I think the playerbase prefers to pay off a small one time fee and be done with it.

HOSCHMOSCH

i know some guys buying ingame stuff for a browsergame worth hundreds of euros. i would pay a small mothly prize for faf if it really helps. my 2 cents

nflanders

@brutus5000 said in [Why would you have left FAF?]

Sucks, but what is the alternative?

What if we start negotiations with Nordic Games?
But who will negotiate? Is there an excellent diplomat in the FAF structure who is capable of such a task?

For example, you can offer joint development of a battle pass. In-game cosmetics for ACU. In exchange, they will make SC:FA free.

If you don’t know where to start, you can consult Chris Taylor. He has extensive experience interacting with publishers. I think he will not refuse help and will tell you how best to negotiate.

Exselsior

Been there tried that. And tried it with people who had money and the will to throw it at the problem. Let’s not turn FAF into a subscription model, thanks.

snoog

@nflanders said in Why would you have left FAF?:

@brutus5000 said in [Why would you have left FAF?]

Sucks, but what is the alternative?

What if we start negotiations with Nordic Games?
But who will negotiate? Is there an excellent diplomat in the FAF structure who is capable of such a task?

For example, you can offer joint development of a battle pass. In-game cosmetics for ACU. In exchange, they will make SC:FA free.

If you don’t know where to start, you can consult Chris Taylor. He has extensive experience interacting with publishers. I think he will not refuse help and will tell you how best to negotiate.

If FAF had a penny for every time someone suggested shit like this, shit like this wouldn't get suggested anymore. But also, props to you for having the shittiest of shit suggestions I've seen. You want microtransactions and a battlepass added to what is essentially already a free game? Yikes

Sprouto

If FAF had a penny for every time someone suggested shit like this, shit like this wouldn't get suggested anymore. But also, props to you for having the shittiest of shit suggestions

These kind of comments....says it all.

RedX

@nflanders said in Why would you have left FAF?:

@brutus5000 said in [Why would you have left FAF?]

Sucks, but what is the alternative?

What if we start negotiations with Nordic Games?
But who will negotiate? Is there an excellent diplomat in the FAF structure who is capable of such a task?

For example, you can offer joint development of a battle pass. In-game cosmetics for ACU. In exchange, they will make SC:FA free.

If you don’t know where to start, you can consult Chris Taylor. He has extensive experience interacting with publishers. I think he will not refuse help and will tell you how best to negotiate.

I'm so confused. What problem are you trying to solve here? You keep making suggestions that seem aimed at bringing in money, but to what end?

FreemanItsNotHe

@brutus5000 said in Why would you have left FAF?:

@nflanders said in Why would you have left FAF?:

@brutus5000 said in [Why would you have left FAF?]

it can be free forever

If everything is free, how can my friend and I try your project for free? A friend has seen enough of Yuri’s video and wants to try playing FAF, but to do this he needs to pay 5 times more than the game costs to an intermediary who will buy him this game since it is not sold in Russia. And spend a lot of time searching for an intermediary and corresponding with him (I bought the game 15 years ago and played on GPGnet)
We play, but only in ~~GAF~~, there is no other option.

For us ordinary players, it doesn’t matter whether you are a commercial or non-profit organization, we still have to pay and it doesn’t matter to whom, the fact is that access to the FAF project is paid.

If I have to make a choice, I would rather FAF become a commercial organization and SC:FA become completely free on Steam.

You can play in GAF, because they give a shit about copyright law and they people running it live in a country where they probably won't be sued for violating copyright law of a "western" company. This doesn't apply to anybody living in Europe or North America.

So players are required to pay the game which on sale costs like 2€ while all other games compared cost a lot more. Sucks, but what is the alternative?

a) Run your own copy of FAF and go the risk yourself. You can do this. This is exactly how GAF works.
b) Collect millions from other people to buy the game rights. But WHY would anybody do this without expecting a return on invest? Be it getting annoyed with ads until the end of the universe or dumbing the game down to reach wider audience or whatever. I think the playerbase prefers to pay off a small one time fee and be done with it.

no one canceled the ability to copy C:\ProgramData\FAForever and send it to a friend and play on RAdmin or another local network

Blodir

Funnily enough, the vibe that I'm getting from the low rating / gapper balance complaints is not too dissimilar from high level balance complaints. A common sentiment among high level mapgen players is that arty/nukes/sat are lame, and people seem to generally prefer exp land wars in lategame. So I don't think the views are totally incompatible.

kirovreporting

@nflanders
They bought this game for their portfolio.
They may not even know that the game has an audience .

Sylph_

@exselsior said in Why would you have left FAF?:

You can technically use the client without having supreme commander installed.

That's a big 'technically', given that you CAN'T use the client without having paid for supreme commander on GoG or steam.
(And like nflander's friend, it was really frustrating for me who bought the game decades ago - and I also have friends who bought the game decades ago, but can't play FaF because they didn't buy it again on GoG/steam)

If I'm honest, I bought it really cheap on GoG - about £3... And I honestly like the fact that accounts are linked to purchases, since it stops smurfing on the ladder VERY effectively. But it is a real shame that so many people who bought supreme commander are probably in the position of being unable to play FaF; particularly given that FaF devs don't get paid for supreme commander purchases!