CounterIntel
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@ftxcommando Jamming and stealth isn't a fundamental departure, but you seemed to be talking about cloned/fake units that do no damage but appear visually to exist and require energy to maintain in your OP. That's something which is a completely new concept (there is no existing mechanic like that).
If you were just talking about some changes re stealth and jamming, then I wouldn't have the same issue as those are already concepts people are familiar with from just playing vanilla FA.
Also if anything Aeon's theme is that it counters stealth and jamming via good visual, i.e. that's its 'counterintel' so it doesnt need a new concept. It has the senor upgrade on its ACU which gives massive visual range; it has the Eye of Rihanne which gives visual range of a target location. An 'in-theme' extension of intel for them would be mechanics based around visibility of a location rather than some sort of hologram concept.
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@zeldafanboy i not saying make scouting harder for the sake of making scouting harder, i am saying make scouting harder for the sake of allowing more fluidity in gameplay. Making scouting more important rather then just "giving it away".
But talk is talk, hell if gonna freaze over before that happens lol
Just think about it, entertain the idea a bit.
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I do not consider vision upgrades counterintel I consider that intel. Counterintel involves player interaction and making it easier to gather intel is not causing your enemy to play in a different way whatsoever nor does it result in you doing anything different. The point is that this game devolves into who made the biggest mass concentration in a set area and obfuscating intel is one of the few ways to make it possible for experienced players to actually get away with less. I’ve been in plenty of situations where navies with more frigates were dissuaded from attacking my UEF frigates and I’ve been in plenty of situations where I walked units into a stealth ACU or cloaked beetles. Aeon just being able to see stuff in an easier way isn’t interactive and it even discourages you from using units that can manipulate this field.
I don’t consider it to be anything new because the mechanics already exist in the game and just result in extending it to all the factions. I don’t even care if the extension is giving Sera and Aeon jamming and stealth, I just gave a new idea because that’s more fun and interesting. There is nothing new like the novel fac spam meta that was a result of HQ introduction (which faf also put into the game to introduce new meta so even if this is a new game aspect it is incoherent to argue that must mean it can only be a mod).
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Also creating unit illusions isn't that far away from the game, as it's just what jamming does, just that it affects vision and is countered by radar not the other way around.
It's like Jamming -> See fake units when you have radar, but no vision
and illusions -> see fake units when you have vision but no radar
Just because that particular ability was not in the original game, doesn't mean it's a complete departure. -
Cybran Core Gimmick (or well in theory): Attack Anywhere But Not Everywhere.
Salems, Wagners, Deceiver and Stealth Boat. Are based on that Cybrans can “hide” from enemy radar. Or deceive the enemy etc.
Aeon is Everywhere but Not Anywhere. IE they have high mobility but not alot of ways to hide it.
UEF “we use punch” there gimmick is they lack mobile flexibilirt of aeon or the ability to hide themselves but are straight forward )hence why Jamming doesn’t hide UEF Unit just make more).
Seraphim is “We A Lil Bit of Everything” basically.
/shrug copypasta is over.
I’m down or think anything is fine. I’d rather see stuff like Seraphim “Weird” Stealth (Selen, the fact rheh can submerge a non zero number of non-naval units) expanded more.*
Aeon I dunno
*Actually what I want is for Sonar Intel Game expanded further. So that subs/submerged are better hidden without dedicayed sonar or omni.
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“Aeon is Everywhere but Not Anywhere. IE they have high mobility but not alot of ways to hide it.”
T-That’s not Aeon at all tho….
What if Seraphim got to utilize cloak (maybe only certain units) so that radar picks the units up but they are out of vision?
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Blame GPGnet not following their own design schema. Also remember faf nerf hover speed. The point is that Aeon Armies aren’t limited by “terrain”
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@nex said in CounterIntel:
Wouldn't cloak be the logical fourth faction mechanic as stealth/jamming and cloak/fake units seems like the obvious counterparts for radar to vision counter-intel.
To make it possible to “fight” against the only thing I could think of was that the units wouldn’t show radar signatures if in the fog of war. I wasn’t sure if it was actually possible to have an icon show up in visual range but no gray dot show up in the fog of war, but that would be a great solution and would make you curious if maybe you just missed the units before your scout went over them.
Also having them always show blips when in vision would make them uncounterable, so the blips would need to disappear once you have them on radar.
Yes, I think more could be done with cloak. An expensive cybran t3 cloak bot for example.
Just an idea, add a cheaper version of the Novax that acts as a spy satellite that can't shoot. It would provide intel for a high price. Could be useful late game.
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i think cloak could be much cooler on non-cybran units (as the combination with stealth is pretty strong).
So you would have something that's pretty strong (a unit that can't be targeted), but also easily countered by a radar.
This would create more of an intel fight by destroying enemy radars/scouts to keep cloak units hidden. -
I agree, cloak is underused but we have to carefully balance this. I think Seraphim getting this would be interesting for faction flavor but they're pretty strong as is...
