New Player Councilor Discussion + Removal Announcements

Morax

Do you dodge questions all the time, too? Where is the sponsor thing coming from?

And no, I am not mad, just calling out some stretch in thiking.

Fremy_Speeddraw

@morax said in New Player Councilor Discussion + Removal Announcements:

Optimism is GREAT. I do not have an issue with that, but how about we see real data and metrics to say "yes, i have sponsors coming, or yes there will be this or that."

219 average viewers is nice. how about previous years? Are we certain the trend is really up ? I don't think we can tell because FAF live has not been around that long.

This is real data and real metrics. I don't think there are any sponsors coming yet and not me nor anyone can tell if there will be, but I know there will be attempts at getting them. What I do know is that 220 > 0 so I don't know why I see people who haven't gotten 220 viewers gathered on a FAF event bicker about the trend of growth not being super clear. Me and FtX have gone and created the thing while noone else ever had any initiative and gotten LoTS from 0 real coverage up to appropriate coverage that is well deserved for the generous donations put out. I don't see why now suddenly as the election is coming up it is apparently a hot topic of concern when in my eyes it's an impressive achievement that doesn't even fall within PC realm of responsibilities.

Morax

@fremy_speeddraw said in New Player Councilor Discussion + Removal Announcements:

@morax said in New Player Councilor Discussion + Removal Announcements:

Optimism is GREAT. I do not have an issue with that, but how about we see real data and metrics to say "yes, i have sponsors coming, or yes there will be this or that."

219 average viewers is nice. how about previous years? Are we certain the trend is really up ? I don't think we can tell because FAF live has not been around that long.

This is real data and real metrics. I don't think there are any sponsors coming yet and not me nor anyone can tell if there will be, but I know there will be attempts at getting them. What I do know is that 220 > 0 so I don't know why I see people who haven't gotten 220 viewers gathered on a FAF event bicker about the trend of growth not being super clear. Me and FtX have gone and created the thing while noone else ever had any initiative and gotten LoTS from 0 real coverage up to appropriate coverage that is well deserved for the generous donations put out. I don't see why now suddenly as the election is coming up it is apparently a hot topic of concern when in my eyes it's an impressive achievement that doesn't even fall within PC realm of responsibilities.

I did not say that FAF Live is not a good idea.

What I said is not a good idea is saying there will be sponsors. Thank you for being honest here and clarifying that the sponsors thing was not a real thing, but hopefully will be.

Morax

@blackheart said in [New Player Councilor Discussion + Removal

Where is your real data and your metrics about all the fancy goals you put in your post?

Please tell me what you would like to see data on in what I posted and I will happily provide it.

FtXCommando

Everyone else already addressed the baseless accusation of star-eyed optimism. My goal for LotS is entirely realistic based on past coverage and the continued buildup of community interaction through consistent coverage of events. Ideally, as casters develop synergies with one another and people covering events get more comfortable with streaming, community interest in events increases. Then, there will be room to do more efficient scheduling where players can cast for a select hour or two and then rotate out in order to maintain a high level of hype that doesn't eventually simmer out. Everything is planned to be improved and I intend for it to improve.

With regards to sponsors and real metrics, I've worked with external organizations that have wanted to collaborate with FAF. I have no interest in going into depth on my communication with them related to events but they have a team that manages their own sponsors and they have given me guidance on how to reach out to organizations. So I'll give a general overview instead.

For one, I don't really get why I would care about you reaching out to bloggers or companies. I have no idea what kind of communication you did nor does getting an article written about a game compare to sponsorships. Entirely irrelevant.

Second, FAFLive is not "just" a random Twitch Channel that covers some niche game. It's the tip of the spear that focuses on large scale community events for a community that manages 20k users a month and has tens of thousands of users across Discord. It absolutely has leverage that would interest sponsors, I've seen much smaller Twitch channels and much smaller communities manage it with competent administration.

Third, even if FAFLive was some random channel, it is still well into the range where things like small scale sponsors would be interested in working with the account. Twitch has several tertiary pages focused on giving assistance to smaller affiliate channels and connecting them to small sponsors. FAFLive is well into partnership territory, a bar orders of magnitude more difficult to reach, and only fails to get there due to a lack of regular scheduling. Often these sponsors look for channels in the 100-150 CCV, which is right where FAFLive currently falls into and will hopefully only continue to grow.

I do not plan on explaining everything out because I consider this a competitive advantage of mine. I put in the dozens of hours to work out how to grow FAF externally, you can elect me if you want that knowledge to work for FAF.

I do not make bullshit statements. I have 3 years of realistic goals and I have accomplished just about every single one of those goals in those 3 years. I will continue to do so.

Morax

Nice, you took the "I don't want to say anything because it will reveal my methods" approach.

Can you at least provide examples of other small twitch channels and what kind of sponsorship was given without going into detail?

FtXCommando

Do your own research.

Judahx

I think a large problem of the faf community is that you guys cater to the highest ranked people. You ignore the majority of the FAF community. Even the balance team is based around the highest rated player base. The majority of the active Community is less than 1k. Not everyone plays on the high skilled games. Most of us play for fun. We like to use this game to relax.

I'm a registered nurse and the nursing board in each state in the United States uses nurses of each level to reprimand and expunge any issues. Having someone who can understand the level of the current player and games played is important

I think the majority of you guys have been in charge of this game for too long and there needs to be New Blood. A lot of you feel threatened when someone new comes along. I've been harassed by multiple people just for talking about true facts about ftxCommando. This only proves my point even further.

Toxic and old leadership will not help this game. We need somebody who is new who is not involved in the elitist echo chamber that's already going on. It's obvious to me this community has been led by the same group for years...

We need someone who is In touch with the novice community as well as the higher rated community. We don't need someone who is completely one-sided for the professionals.

Regardless if you're professional player or a mediocre player or a novice player your opinion is important

Emperor penguin understands every aspect of the player community. He is a decent person and is what we need. Heck he's even one of the most major contributors of the map generator which is hugely popular.

Judahx

.

We don't need another elitist in power!

Jip

I see someone holding grounds for what they stand for. What is wrong with that?

FtXCommando

@judahx said in New Player Councilor Discussion + Removal Announcements:

Emperor penguin understands every aspect of the player community. He is a decent person and is what we need. Heck he's even one of the most major contributors of the map generator which is hugely popular.

Wait till you find out how much effort I've put into helping Sheikah make map gen competitively viable, brother.

Dragun101

So lets us all take a step back. Now Penguin the first genuine time I interacted with was about some mapping and me poking fun at myself.
@Morax and @FtXCommando my first interactions beyond just person talking on discord with someone else. Was when I approached Morax, about the SCTA mod stuff about a year ago. And Ftx, we talked a few months later when I began doing initial planning for SCTA 2v2 #1. Now both of you were very supportive of my work. Or well lets elaborate:
Morax I came to you, as M&M, about SCTA and Vault. From June to September you supported me where you could, offered advice, and let me show you the mod a few times a month. And you told me no to uploading initially. Now I will come back to that later.

Ftx, when I first came to, you were initially hesitant due a variety of reasons, I was a new member of the community, SCTA among other things being a mod. My initial map pool idea, and more. As well as the first avatars I made as prizes, you told me were garbage.

Now fast forward, one of the last acts Morax you did, as M&M was let me upload the mod. After I had done a significant amount of work on improving the mod, replacing various models within the mod. And despite a certain member of the community, initial association with the SCTA Project and I. You were willing to overlook that and more so still lend your support and helping hand when needed. So the mod that ultimately came to the vault was one that was far cleaner, far less buggy, and in a far better state. Also while two other friends of mine helped me set it up , you were the guy who told me about github. Which has made SCTA project, coding, bugfixing, etc actually reasonable and possible.

Had you not been willing to say no, I would likely finished the mod in June, upload the "balance" version and not looked back. I think anyone who was in the SCTA Alpha can say beyond reasonable doubt that if the mod had been left in that state....would had left alot to be desired.

Ftx, you told me no, because you believed their been lack of signs up (and in fairness the first tournament had only 6 teams. The second one didn't even fire). And you also told my initial choice of avatars, left ALOT to be desired as well my map choices were bad or worse. So we went through, and you helped me choose new maps for the tournament. While folks might taken issue with the format (maps being repeated), the result was varied gameplay but also gameplay that wasn't the standard landspam fun times. And you helped me setup the challonge etc, and told me outright the potential issues or problems. You didn't beat around the bush.

But when I made clear, yes I was interested in doing this, you supported me as described, helped me choose the maps. And 'assigned' Swkoll to help me work through my first TD experience. Had you not done that, what would happened been basically of series of 1v1 ladder maps played in 2v2 or maps I had a personal bias for or against. And then in Rainbow, you took several hours, to work with Fearghal on his AI tournament. Which all things considered could been a mess otherwise from what I know both from helping Fearghal and otherwise.

Both you and Morax, (maybe I am insane, I could be, been long time), were hesitant about allowing MapGen in ladder or 1v1. For competitive play due a variety of reasons and repeatedly said no to random Aeolus asking for it (also Nomads but that a different discussion and I think between Morax and Ftx, only Ftx responded to those). And now we got MapGen? We have a generator with a wide variety of biomes, varied reclaim, and more. So, as councilor, the hardest, even if many say its the easiest, job is the act of saying 'no'.

I use myself as an example because I know that story well enough. As a councilor, can you explain why the act of saying "No", even if sometimes blunt or harshly is needed?

And @Emperor_Penguin , my question for you, is would you say 'No'? Do you understand the power of 'No'?

Aulex

@ftxcommando said in New Player Councilor Discussion + Removal Announcements:

@judahx said in New Player Councilor Discussion + Removal Announcements:

Emperor penguin understands every aspect of the player community. He is a decent person and is what we need. Heck he's even one of the most major contributors of the map generator which is hugely popular.

Wait till you find out how much effort I've put into helping Sheikah make map gen competitively viable, brother.

Thank you

Anachronism_

@dragun101
FTX delaying the availability of map gen on ladder/TMM isn't why it has improved so much. It was being improved a lot regardless.

However, I absolutely do take strong stances on certain things and am not afraid to say "No" when the situation warrants it. For example, when FTX expressed that he wanted to and actively planned to remove Global Rating from FAF and make all normal (non-TMM) games be unrated, I took a strong stance against that, which I still stand by, as I strongly believe that that is not in the best interests of FAF, and that is supported by a myriad of conversations I've had with numerous FAF players. So, as PC, I would strongly oppose removing global rating and would say "No" to removing it.
Frankly, FTX's plan to remove Global Rating would be a major negative for a very large portion of active FAF players, and hiding or removing it would undoubtedly cause countless FAF players to quit FAF entirely. My approach, as outlined in my PC application, is to get more people playing ladder/TMM by making them better for everyone, while keeping Global Rating, but making it easier for new players to get started.
I took a similarly strong stance when Morax wanted to remove the 'most recent' section of the FAF client, which would've catered to the desires of some 'elite' mappers at the expense of the majority of map-makers for FAF. In short, I am not afraid to take strong oppositional stances or say "No." I try to act in the best interests of FAF, period.

Judahx

Let's be honest the majority of you guys who are applying for this position have been out of touch with the community for years. A lot of people who have obtained their ranks have done so with the assistance from Clans or friends in high ranks. FTX and MORAX are using Clans and their Connections to get votes

The majority of the FAF player base may not vote for these issues like PC. To be honest they probably don't even know a vote is it going on. I fear this makes the community stuck in stagnation.

If you really care about votes from the entire community, 80% of the news page would mention up-and-coming votes. I Understand changing this will take time.

I feel that the only person who is able to represent all levels of the player base fairly at this time is Emperor penguin. He is not an elitist, he is not stagnant and he isn't self-absorbed like many of the applicants.

This is all my personal opinion, but I believe it to be the truth. I am not quoting a bunch of 2000 Rated players who think they represent the entire community. I truly hope we get the entire Community involved for the voting and not just some microcosm of elitist.

Judahx

SpikeyNoob

@judahx as someone who is mot a 2k rated player (1200) i think ftx is has done alot to make faf fun. For instance just today i spent a while watching the faf live show matches, tomorrow i am playing in a scta tourny that is in his domain, and whenever i look at the discord ftx is contributing. I dont know emperor and i am not against him, i just think it is unfair to say that ftx only caters to 2ks.

Judahx

This post is deleted!

ThomasHiatt

If anyone is out of touch with the community it is all the people arguing here. This is just a video game, and nobody needs to represent anyone. Normal people just play the game because they want to, and do not want to be involved in all of this stupid drama. Stagnation is actually the goal of FAF. The point is to keep this 14 year old game around so people can keep playing it like they always have.

Judahx

@thomashiatt said in New Player Councilor Discussion + Removal Announcements:

If anyone is out of touch with the community it is all the people arguing here. This is just a video game, and nobody needs to represent anyone. Normal people just play the game because they want to, and do not want to be involved in all of this stupid drama. Stagnation is actually the goal of FAF. The point is to keep this 14 year old game around so people can keep playing it like they always have.

And order to keep this 14 year old game around we need to support new players.
We need New blood who understands old a new players. The same PC will only promote stagnation and lack of new ideas. A PC who primarily reaches out to the the high rank player base will not keep this game going.

The player base is getting older. People have kids. WE need outreach. Stagnation will just kill us off slowly. People will get tired spend time with family's. At the end of the day, lack of change will see us playing on the the steam client.

Whoever is left....

Holding on isn't enough..

Dragun101

@emperor_penguin said in New Player Councilor Discussion + Removal Announcements:

@dragun101
FTX delaying the availability of map gen on ladder/TMM isn't why it has improved so much. It was being improved a lot regardless.

However, I absolutely do take strong stances on certain things and am not afraid to say "No" when the situation warrants it. For example, when FTX expressed that he wanted to and actively planned to remove Global Rating from FAF and make all normal (non-TMM) games be unrated, I took a strong stance against that, which I still stand by, as I strongly believe that that is not in the best interests of FAF, and that is supported by a myriad of conversations I've had with numerous FAF players. So, as PC, I would strongly oppose removing global rating and would say "No" to removing it.
Frankly, FTX's plan to remove Global Rating would be a major negative for a very large portion of active FAF players, and hiding or removing it would undoubtedly cause countless FAF players to quit FAF entirely. My approach, as outlined in my PC application, is to get more people playing ladder/TMM by making them better for everyone, while keeping Global Rating, but making it easier for new players to get started.
I took a similarly strong stance when Morax wanted to remove the 'most recent' section of the FAF client, which would've catered to the desires of some 'elite' mappers at the expense of the majority of map-makers for FAF. In short, I am not afraid to take strong oppositional stances or say "No." I try to act in the best interests of FAF, period.

I’ll make this brief cause adhd powers ACTIVATED. But your missing the point. Ftx making MapGen good or bad personally is irrelevant, its not his job.

His job is curation so only quality, enters the ladder pool or gets hosted as tournaments. Now you can debate that granted.

Or the best quality of FAF is presented for the player experience. The power of no, is not just saying this is idea is bad. It is also “Is at moment in time this (x) is not up to standards desired for the enviroment”.