Buff Wagner back

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@advena said in Buff Wagner back:

It meet but barely.

Tbh you are missing 1 key point, and I've hinted at it several times just maybe not in away you understood properly.
You need to explain how you are using these in your personal games and what you've seen. While a replay would help a simple description of where the problem may be occurring can be done in text.

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Wagner is complete gorbage. Make them able to better kill pd so they dont get hardcountered by 2 pds on islands

I think a good change would be to change their gun in a way they can hit pd reliably without hitting walls too much that way they are still sheit against units but get more viable at their actual only role: raiding

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Looks like I should explain how I see roles of T2 amphibious units and why wagner is bad in some of them.

  1. Raiding. Wagner is fine. Overall unit strength is not that important as speed, stealth, cost and DPS.
  2. Land fallback option in different cases. In this area wagner is shit because of bad stats. This I suggest to fix.
    Reasons when you want to have fallback option:
    2.1) Swamp maps. They are rare and have other balance issues.
    2.2) Overall choice of more mobile army in some cases.
    2.3) Bad main tank performance in some cases. Notably Aeon against T1 spam and Cybran at hilly maps
  3. Navy fallback option. Not applicable to wagner. (Unless you make it floating on surface)

Most important problem IMO is 2.3

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@advena Wagner basically is everything the t2 floaties are but worse, and missing the ability to properly damage navy. Blazes are much better at raiding than a wagner.

The stealth is pretty irrelevant.

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the wagner at 200 mass or with more hp would be broken underwater, what they need is rocket damage to function better vs broken t1 pd and t1 spam out of range 🙏

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Why not give Wagners stealth??????? Would emphasize their raiding role, fit well within the cybran faction theme, add fun and surprise to the game and I think stealth is an underused feature in faf where radar is so important in general. Come on!!

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They already have stealth functionally speaking when they are underwater unless you mean sonar

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Add a Float/dive button?

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You cannot combine Wagner's role as annoying amphibious raiding unit on large map and a decent ish normal tank. Right now it does the first well while being a weak normal tank. If you buff it then it will become OP on large navy raiding maps, if you change it in a way that nerfs it's raiding role you remove the only thing that's special about it. There is a case to be made for nerfing it's under water speed even more while buffing it's raw stats but again, you take away Wagner's advantages in its specialty because you want to bring it more line with standard bland tanks.