@e33144211332424 For a game replay..

https://replay.faforever.com/17034400

I believe this mechanic functions as an exploit due to a flaw in the game's targeting and collision logic.

Currently, players can group a massive number of submarines (e.g., 80 units) and issue a spread order (Shift-G). If these grouped subs fight an equal number of ungrouped subs, the grouped side wins overwhelmingly—losing only 10 to 20 units while completely wiping out the enemy.

This happens because the game engine allows multiple units to occupy the exact same physical space, but its targeting logic only registers them as a single target. When the ungrouped enemy fires, all of their damage is concentrated on just one sub at a time. Once it dies, the remaining 79 subs are completely unharmed.

To mimic real-world physics, the game should handle this in one of two ways:

Collision Damage: Prevent units from stacking perfectly. If they try to occupy the same space, they should collide and take damage.

AoE / Shared Damage: If 80 subs are allowed to stack on one point, any incoming attack hitting that point should damage all 80 units simultaneously.

As it stands, this stacking behavior bypasses intended combat balance and acts as a major exploit.

It isn't a matter if one can do it or not, would assert it is a cheat.
1.) No two units should be able to occupy the same physical space.
2.) If not group and i return fire i'm only aiming or able to target 1 unit, VS. the 80 shooting at mine, and the shift-g spreads the fire...

Why if i have 80 subs and you grop yours, all min dye, and you may have lost 5 or 10...

A cheat isn't a cheat because people can or can't do it. The fact people are able to and gain an advantage that i'd assert is unfair. i.e. i lose 80 subs for you 5 or 10... So it doesn't matter if people are able to do it or not. does it go against the spirit of the game...? Sure seems like a cheat to me i'l gladly trade 80 subs for 10... I'll win that every day...

@maudlin27 Fair question. One of the overall design goals for Supreme Commander was to allow players to be commanders without requiring them to micromanage units. Given that you are in a large battle, I guess you could divert your attention to just your subs in one spot. But if you miss it, you will lose the sea faster than anything...

The question isn't whether both players can cheat; the point is that people shouldn't be able to. Two wrongs don't make it right... The fact that it works highlights a flaw in the game's logic and people may exploit it, as it only sees one sub in that spot. I would say a cheat is something that takes advantage/quick in the a deficiency within the game's logic that people may exploit. How is it not a cheat? Just because two people can doesn't justify a cheat? And just because one player did and the other not because they were busy elsewhere and exploiting a flaw in the game they get a HUGE unfair advantage. Oh that would be a cheat...? Explain how it is not a cheat?

@FtXCommando I would disagree. You obviously sound like you don't know what you are talking about as it isn't just me reporting it and other confirm it...

Any suggestions? Trying with the new Rust client, host a game one minute later i get a note saying:

The room you hosted no longer exists and has been disconnected.

I've tried all the different adapters java, experimental... Nothing seems to help

Any suggestions?

Oh ya, the old java client may host but disconnects in 5-10 seconds...

Same for me as well. Trying to host with the old client... Rooms you crash nearly immediately. Tried the new Rust client. Yesterday, all day after installing it work perfect, no issue, all was good. Not today i start up the Rust client. Each room crashed out within a minute or 30 seconds.

Anyone else having issue with hosting a game. I can't host a lobby without it crashing in 30 seconds or less. The game os crashing or disappearing from the list in FAF, and i get a notice "The lobby you were hosting is no longer connected...".

Seems the problem has been common with FA forever. But i would only see lobbies crash after say 20 or 30 minutes, never less time than that. But now most all lobbies i host 30 seconds or less, ever lobby i try hosting... splat every lobby i create. What changed? Or how can i get a lobby to stay up so i can host...?

@FtXCommando Ya i use shift-g for attacking other units, with subs it is different as one may stack the subs into one spot. If the group now attacks an enemy they only see one sub so 80 vs 80 subs the ungrouped will always lose. Generally it will be the grouped may lose 5 or 10 units. Sure seems like a cheat.

@FtXCommando I would disagree. You obviously sound like you don't know what you are talking about as it isn't just me reporting it and other confirm it...

@maudlin27 Fair question. One of the overall design goals for Supreme Commander was to allow players to be commanders without requiring them to micromanage units. Given that you are in a large battle, I guess you could divert your attention to just your subs in one spot. But if you miss it, you will lose the sea faster than anything...

The question isn't whether both players can cheat; the point is that people shouldn't be able to. Two wrongs don't make it right... The fact that it works highlights a flaw in the game's logic and people may exploit it, as it only sees one sub in that spot. I would say a cheat is something that takes advantage/quick in the a deficiency within the game's logic that people may exploit. How is it not a cheat? Just because two people can doesn't justify a cheat? And just because one player did and the other not because they were busy elsewhere and exploiting a flaw in the game they get a HUGE unfair advantage. Oh that would be a cheat...? Explain how it is not a cheat?

It isn't a matter if one can do it or not, would assert it is a cheat.
1.) No two units should be able to occupy the same physical space.
2.) If not group and i return fire i'm only aiming or able to target 1 unit, VS. the 80 shooting at mine, and the shift-g spreads the fire...

Why if i have 80 subs and you grop yours, all min dye, and you may have lost 5 or 10...

A cheat isn't a cheat because people can or can't do it. The fact people are able to and gain an advantage that i'd assert is unfair. i.e. i lose 80 subs for you 5 or 10... So it doesn't matter if people are able to do it or not. does it go against the spirit of the game...? Sure seems like a cheat to me i'l gladly trade 80 subs for 10... I'll win that every day...

I believe this mechanic functions as an exploit due to a flaw in the game's targeting and collision logic.

Currently, players can group a massive number of submarines (e.g., 80 units) and issue a spread order (Shift-G). If these grouped subs fight an equal number of ungrouped subs, the grouped side wins overwhelmingly—losing only 10 to 20 units while completely wiping out the enemy.

This happens because the game engine allows multiple units to occupy the exact same physical space, but its targeting logic only registers them as a single target. When the ungrouped enemy fires, all of their damage is concentrated on just one sub at a time. Once it dies, the remaining 79 subs are completely unharmed.

To mimic real-world physics, the game should handle this in one of two ways:

Collision Damage: Prevent units from stacking perfectly. If they try to occupy the same space, they should collide and take damage.

AoE / Shared Damage: If 80 subs are allowed to stack on one point, any incoming attack hitting that point should damage all 80 units simultaneously.

As it stands, this stacking behavior bypasses intended combat balance and acts as a major exploit.

Thought there use to be an option to change the font size in the FAF client. But the font in the UI now seems like it is 4pt and simply can't read most messages...

Is there a config file where i could set the font size?

Game seem slow on accepting input/orders. Very noticeable when you see a bunch of T3 Bombers about to snipe your comm... Something appears to have changed in the last month or two when giving orders to units. So you see you comm is about to get snipped by bombers or tac missiles... So you select the unit, order it to move and, nothing the unit will die because the orders weren't carried out. This seems to have started a month or so back, never entered an issue, but it is really noticeable... As long as i've played, one could always have been able to select the unit and have it move immediately. It seems the delay is easily between 5 to 10 seconds now, and the units one use to save is now dead...