Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread
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Literally every UEF t2 air option got hit with a nerf and every other faction is untouched, gg
Well, they got their transports nerfed too so nvm!
Why are ASF getting an HP increase and a damage increase as well? The adjustment to janus, in combination with that, basically means janus is hedged in by both int and ASF spam now and the whole utility of it as an all in move is dead when that's all it was good for.
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Happy to see the T3 MAA buff - for too long T2 MAA have outclassed T3 MAA in almost every way (even vs single strats T3 MAA weren't dramatically better)
Teleport range nerf feels harsh - on a 20km map a range of 350 isn't much for such a critical unit. Would've been nice if it was combined with a reduced delay on the teleport to allow you to chain teleports together - i.e. to teleport to the enemy base you have to teleport to a halfway point first, then the base, giving the opposing team a chance to react in advance of the main teleport. With the current teleport delay though such a tactic feels too risky unless you have map control (and chances are if you're going for teleport you dont have map control).
Don't get why stinger is getting nerfed when it's already bad thanks to missing lots of shots on t1 units. I could see the change if it was combined with the hitbox issue being resolved, but on it's own I find it strange.
Happy to see the T3 air fac build time increased, and Seraphim's T2 gunship be a bit more usable later in the game.
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Thinking about the teleport change more, I don’t understand if telemazor is still considered overpowered, why isn’t it being nerfed directly? I don’t see anyone complaining sera-tele is op, or tele-sacu, or tele-gc; it adds variety and fun to the game to have these, and they’re going to become completely unusable after this change.
Why not just nerf the teleport upgrade for the cybran acu? There’s already precedent for the same/similar upgrade to cost different amounts and have different effects (nano; ras; etc), why not teleport?
For example, double the upgrade costs of only the cybran acu; or (less desirably since it impacts the ability itsef) give the cybran acu only a range limited teleport.
Alternatively why not massively decrease the build cost of teleport? With the short range it’s far more likely to be a one way trip and much easier to counter, so why does it need to cost as much as it does to get the upgrade in the first place?
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Billy nuke teleport js real
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Besides the t2 UEF air changes which I'm not too sure about, I'm excited to see some T3 air changes. Hopefully change up the meta a bit.
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The T2 transport changes are heavy-handed IMO. AFAIK, they're designed specifically to target T2 arty drops, which we all know are extremely strong, but nerfing the transport movement speed does significant collateral damage to various aggressive drop playstyles that I feel strongly are NOT currently overpowered:
- Com Drops (was already nerfed heavily with T3 ACU bp changes)
- Sparkies
- Early T3 land unit drops (different game stage)
If I'm correct that the goal is to nerf arty drops specifically, I'd propose that T1 arty be given a "drop cooldown" that prevents them from firing for 2-2.5x their typical reload time after being dropped from a transport. You could also potentially add some small movement freeze (1-3sec). That increases the response time before they begin doing damage, allowing typical counters like LABs and T1 bombers to get in range before arty DPS is being applied. This could have some interesting consequences, like incentivizing people to mix in some tanks for instant DPS application.
If the goal isn't only to nerf arty drops, and other aggressive drop strategies are also intentionally being targeted, I really question the logic of that. Sparkies, T3 ACU drops, etc. are all expensive and extremely scoutable, and T2 transport speed was already nerfed from having parity with interceptors.
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@atlas_ said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
If I'm correct that the goal is to nerf arty drops specifically, I'd propose that T1 arty be given a "drop cooldown" that prevents them from firing for 2-2.5x their typical reload time after being dropped from a transport. You could also potentially add some small movement freeze (1-3sec). That increases the response time before they begin doing damage, allowing typical counters like LABs and T1 bombers to get in range before arty DPS is being applied. This could have some interesting consequences, like incentivizing people to mix in some tanks for instant DPS application.
Wow I was reading the changes and I didn't think anyone would propose something even worse instead of an improvement. Impressive.
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The T3 MAA becoming cheaper and more spammable + HP normalization is good. Flak all have the same HP, which is good, although T1 MAA have slightly different HP (And Aeon has the lowest, not Cybran). I guess air gets so much more important the longer the game goes on its only fair for every faction to have identical HP on their land AA.
The T2 air changes are mostly lip curling. Nerfing T2 transport speed again? Making the Stinger even weaker and more spammable so it's even worse against flak? Making the Vulthoo even denser so it's better against flak? Nerfing the Janus spamability? Making ASF even more resistant to ground AA?
Air HQ timing coming online a bit later is whatever. Although that combined with the UEF air nerfs seems punishing for air UEF players.
Teleport being worthless (aside from Billy memes, the teleport upgrade is now worthless on ACUS) is so lame. When you take the E cost into account, Telemaser can be countered quite cost-effectively with multiple shield layering and T2 PD. The Cybran ACU just continues to be homogenized with increased vision nerfing stealth, getting nano-regen, and now this.
For SACUs, now Aeons can't tele sacrifice GC. Seraphim can't tele OC. Seems like it just makes the late game less dynamic and volatile.
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I’d rather factions get diff ranges for their teleports tbh. Aeon and Sera are epic aliens, they get no range limit but they have current expensive teleport. Cyb and UEF work with Earth tech, get a range cap but slightly cheaper teleport or something.
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A fun idea and preserves the tele gc meme which I would hate to see go away. It's not like that's something that messes up balance in team games with how expensive and rare it is anyway
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@zeldafanboy said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
The T3 MAA becoming cheaper and more spammable + HP normalization is good. Flak all have the same HP, which is good, although T1 MAA have slightly different HP (And Aeon has the lowest, not Cybran). I guess air gets so much more important the longer the game goes on its only fair for every faction to have identical HP on their land AA.
My understanding is that they are lowering the HP of all the AA, not giving them all the same HP.
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I can't understand why you want to nerf telemazer and kill all teleports at the same time. It is like you want to kill fly and use nuke for this.
Imho if only problem is telemazer, then increase its build time or cost, only for cybran acu, otherwise you kill all other uses of teleports.
You even increase size of teleport visuals, while many units got buff for direct vision not long ago. Just go further and make enemy team see pings and message in chat "warning, you being telemazered"
If you really must nerf something, nerf seraphim telesacu, i mean its kinda op when you can teleport unit with more than 50k hp directly to smd or game ender, and even more op when you teleport few of those at the same time. Having teledef from telemazer is not even nearly enough to counter sera telesacu.
So instead of buffing uef acu with blly and teleport in different slots, i'd like to see sera sacu with teleport and nanoregen in the same slot. -
Also make mercy great again
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@ftxcommando said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
Why are ASF getting an HP increase and a damage increase as well?
I assume that the change was just for the sake of processor power - less interceptors = less CPU tax.
There's a knock-on effect of making them more resistant to flak, of course, but I just assumed that CPU tax was the primary reason for the change, given that ASF swarms get crazy numbers in big team games.
The fact that their damage/second and hitpoints were significantly buffed is what led me to this assumption. -
That's not a good reason, really when it has a huge impact on t2 air's relation to t3 air. The extra HP and damage means ASF are basically perpetually outvetting any damage your t2 air will ever do to them.
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Should just increase build time and cost of all air units of the same tier by % you want to decrease their amount . People mainly use big grids without assist to spam asf and use 1 or 2 factories with heavy assistance when building strats or t3 gunships. So it won't be big nerf to strat building, but will have impact to mass asf spam. And they still be same ol asf that we know without much troubles, that could potentially appear with ground and sea aa, other air tier planes
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@redx said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
@zeldafanboy said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
The T3 MAA becoming cheaper and more spammable + HP normalization is good. Flak all have the same HP, which is good, although T1 MAA have slightly different HP (And Aeon has the lowest, not Cybran). I guess air gets so much more important the longer the game goes on its only fair for every faction to have identical HP on their land AA.
My understanding is that they are lowering the HP of all the AA, not giving them all the same HP.
It's only for the non-Cybran Factions. Even if they aren't equalizing HP, they are normalizing it.
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@relentless said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
Whats the determining factor in the teleport range? e.g Is it aimed at 10km maps?
It's hard to imagine the exact impact since it's very map dependant, but it is mostly meant as an impact for 20km maps (since it's usually a lot stronger there since there are more spread out bases and more spots with no vision)
@maudlin27 said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
Don't get why stinger is getting nerfed when it's already bad thanks to missing lots of shots on t1 units. I could see the change if it was combined with the hitbox issue being resolved, but on it's own I find it strange.
@zeldafanboy said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
The T2 air changes are mostly lip curling. Nerfing T2 transport speed again? Making the Stinger even weaker and more spammable so it's even worse against flak? Making the Vulthoo even denser so it's better against flak? Nerfing the Janus spamability? Making ASF even more resistant to ground AA?
The stinger "nerf" is not a nerf for the same reason as the soulripper and bulwark nerfs weren't a nerf but a buff (in different scenario's that is). I think it's quite funny that people instantly see the vulthoo change as a buff even though it technically worsens the stats / mass invested compared to the current version while the stinger more or less stays the same.
T2 transport speed has been untouched for 6 entire years. You make it sound like we're chain nerfing it. Also if you missed it t2 transports got a huge mobility buff in the last patch which makes them way more maneuverable. In combination with the fact that inties still have an incredible hard time to catch t2 transports because they are very dumb with pathfinding makes this a necessary change.
Asf keep the same hp/mass ratio which by nature means that ground aa has the same impact on asf after this change.
@zeldafanboy said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
The T3 MAA becoming cheaper and more spammable + HP normalization is good. Flak all have the same HP, which is good, although T1 MAA have slightly different HP (And Aeon has the lowest, not Cybran). I guess air gets so much more important the longer the game goes on its only fair for every faction to have identical HP on their land AA.
There is no normalization on t3 maa. All non sera factions have very slight differences. Sera t3 maa are unique and should be put seperately in there (cause of different stats) but until gieb gives me permission to edit my own post it stays like this.
@ftxcommando said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
I’d rather factions get diff ranges for their teleports tbh. Aeon and Sera are epic aliens, they get no range limit but they have current expensive teleport. Cyb and UEF work with Earth tech, get a range cap but slightly cheaper teleport or something.
Making tele upgrades different per faction is something i want to work to yes. It makes sense to do it to balance it out, but for now i didn't have the time yet to think about the exact details so i wanted to add the range change to beta and see what impact it has to have a better understanding what changes the factions need.
@eminence said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
Imho if only problem is telemazer, then increase its build time or cost, only for cybran acu,
See above. Also it is not feasible to simply nerf 1 factions teleport without anything in return. The nano upgrades for different factions are of different costs but also of different strengths. We will not have the same strength teleport upgrade with different costs.
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@ftxcommando said in Pending Balance Changes Feedback Thread:
I’d rather factions get diff ranges for their teleports tbh. Aeon and Sera are epic aliens, they get no range limit but they have current expensive teleport. Cyb and UEF work with Earth tech, get a range cap but slightly cheaper teleport or something.
What range are you thinking about? It would be cool to have a Late T2-Early T3 teleport with a shorter channeling time, teleport E cost, and price that could allow for tactical sniping instead of strategic sniping. For example, sniping shields to start a fight, teleporting behind a T2 pd to OC it before it can turn around, etc. Or start a fight with rambo com, teleport back when HP is low enough.
