My thoughts about balance

@xiaomao said in My thoughts about balance:

@gabitii said in My thoughts about balance:

@sladow-noob said in My thoughts about balance:

I hope you included Tryth's replay as well where he crushed you two times as both Aeon and UEF in your navy-balance tests. Maximum cringe and clown to not even mention that one even though it was literally the thing you wanted to test.

Absolute clowntake to tell that he "crushed me two times" when I have not even played against him. I have not included this in test, cause Tryth has only tested 2 small skirmishes, which is not enought to make a proper conclusion. When I pmed him and asked to test further, he rejected. If you want to change my mind in navy let's test against you. But not 2 skirmishes like tryth did. But a good one like Spikey did.

I mean, you said you will let the better navy player play. And got some "GOOD" dual gap navy player to play instead of you. So not sure why are pulling the "he didn't crush me" when you literally let the better player play instead of you. Unless you lied and threw a random flunky to play vs tryth.

I will stop answering on why I did not include this test. It is irrelevant on my thread and causes toxic and offensive discussion. If you want, let's go and test. I am ready to test anyone who is willing to prove their point.

@tryth at least same amount as Spikey did.

You also say nothas are OP but they are literally the easiest unit to dodge in the game

@gabitii what an hour . I’ll do best of 5 but that’s about it

@tryth said in My thoughts about balance:

And I might be miss reading this bec it’s a bit confusing, but from my understanding your complaining about subs being too strong, but ur suggesting to give them another buff in DPS and cost?

I told not to give another buff in DPS. I told that buff in HP is not what needed. I told that INSTEAD of buff in HP should be either buff in DPS or buff in cost.

About aeon: i think their t1 land is the most interesting right now, and you should not touch auroras like at all. For open maps you have flares (if anything you want to touch them over auroras), after that you leverage cancer induced by flares to your opponent to transition to t2 land or smth. And you have auroras for more closed or small maps, they are superior to regular tanks in those conditions because you can kite reliably and speed is not an issue, etc. Making aurora another variant of t1 tank is just so bad, literally killing the most interesting part of t1 land.

Guys, I do not really get on why you are so agressive against me. I am literally sharing my experience and thoughts on game and I am also willing to make this game better. I am not trying to offend someone personally or tell that ur opinion is wrong. I gave like lots of points where game can be improved in my opinion and you keep telling me about those 2 skirmishes. I am thinking more general than the skirmish between 2 certain players. Except for that, I also mentioned a lot except for navy. If you do not agree on navy, just focus on other suggestions or argument where I am wrong. No point of insulting me or calling me somehow. Just prove that I am wrong and I will admit it.

@gabitii ah ok

No time to read all posts, just pointing out i won as aeon every time destro vs destro. Only the niche gap style fights was were i would lose. And even then not by very much. Not to disregard ur points, but claiming he won every time wothout mentioning that it was a niche fight and not really destro v destro is a bit misleading

@spikeynoob said in My thoughts about balance:

No time to read all posts, just pointing out i won as aeon every time destro vs destro. Only the niche gap style fights was were i would lose. And even then not by very much. Not to disregard ur points, but claiming he won every time wothout mentioning that it was a niche fight and not really destro v destro is a bit misleading

Poggers @gabitii why u lying bro?

@gabitii its just a matter of different perspectives, you play dual gap so your opinion on balance is wildly different from dudes playing like 1800+ mapgen, and dualgap is a map known for its simplicity and general resident burger vibes, and rightfully so. Balance team does not account for dualgap so you need to understand why your opinion is met how it is met. Perhaps, if you tried to play in those 1800+ lobbies you would understand why some of your ideas are not working. Right now noone wants to explain stuff for you because like these complaints were mused over like 82737363 times and its a waste of time really

@tomma said in My thoughts about balance:

@gabitii Perhaps, if you tried to play in those 1800+ lobbies you would understand why some of your ideas are not working. Right now noone wants to explain stuff for you because like these complaints were mused over like 82737363 times and its a waste of time really

1800+ mapgen lobbies are very rare thing to play and it is usually played not more than 3v3. And also, I feel that it is kind of unfair to consider only those lobbies as foundation for balance, cause the biggest part of the player are not 1800+ rated players.

The biggest part of the community also doesn't have clue how to play this game.

@tryth said in My thoughts about balance:

@spikeynoob said in My thoughts about balance:

No time to read all posts, just pointing out i won as aeon every time destro vs destro. Only the niche gap style fights was were i would lose. And even then not by very much. Not to disregard ur points, but claiming he won every time wothout mentioning that it was a niche fight and not really destro v destro is a bit misleading

Poggers @gabitii why u lying bro?

I have not lied, in most of real-game like situation cybran has won, you also told it is not real that 10 destros vs 10 destros is impossible, you will have more frigs, which I agree on. S

@spikeynoob said in My thoughts about balance:

Not to disregard ur points, but claiming he won every time wothout mentioning that it was a niche fight and not really destro v destro is a bit misleading

Sorry for that. Forgot to mention one important point: Most of the battles were won by cybran with the composition of frigs + destros, mostly early t2 or mid t2 stage.

Also a note: Spikey is incredibly good at microing destros, yet, he won no fight against sera destros with aeon.

@xiaomao said in My thoughts about balance:

The biggest part of the community also doesn't have clue how to play this game.

So which means you only want to make balance for 1800+ mapgens lobbies, right?

@gabitii No he’s saying you guys don’t know how to use the units correctly

No single game thats played competitively is balanced towards the average player because it would result in either massively dumbing down the game or be completely imbalanced in way more maps and gamemodes than just a single map

@tryth said in My thoughts about balance:

@gabitii No he’s saying you guys don’t know how to use the units correctly

Honestly, from the gameplay of 2k+ mapgen players. I would say they are better not because they know how to use mobile units better, but because they do know way better how to balance resources. And I do not only mean having your resource bar to be perfect, but in the gameplay. How much resources you need to spend for defence, for example, lower rated players usually spend way more in defense then needed. They have a better experience in attacking gathering a critical mass, so that it will not be a mass donation. And also importatn mention they do know better of how much BP they need right now and how much BP they will be needing in a short future. It is not only about using units properly, it is about rightfully spending resources (not meant of balancing the resource bar). It is my perspective of how I see top players.

@thewheelie said in My thoughts about balance:

No single game thats played competitively is balanced towards the average player because it would result in either massively dumbing down the game or be completely imbalanced in way more maps and gamemodes than just a single map

What about my concrete suggestions on balance?

@gabitii it was already explained why dualgap is out of scope of balance discussions, i wont repeat it. Doesnt matter if half playerbase resides there, if it means that every other map gets fucked to make it more enjoyable for you, its not happening. Besides, if any sort of high rated game not on dualgap style map is good enough to understand more about how balance works outside of gap! Just queue like 3v3 or smth