Let's make global rating affected by TMM

It can be hard for greys/new players to get decent games. Getting kicked for being grey is a major negative in the new player experience, and it's not always easy to find a desirable 'all welcome' game.

Making global rating affected by TMM games would help to overcome this hurdle. It would also be sensible.

The calculations that determine the change in global rating from a TMM game could be based on the calculations using the players' global ratings (as though it was hosted in a rated custom lobby). Additionally, the relevant TMM rating would still be affected independently, based on its proper calculations (such as it is now).

Furthermore, if many people want to keep a separate rating system specific to rated custom games (what global rating is used for now), then I'd propose that global rating be duplicated and have the base version be renamed to something like 'custom rating'. Then, we'd have a 'custom rating' that functions exactly how 'global rating' functions now, and we'd have an actual 'global rating' that is affected by rated custom games as well as TMM games. Alternatively, we could stick with calling the current thing 'global rating' and make the new thing that includes TMM and rated custom games be called something like 'universal rating'. Regardless of what we call it, I think it'd probably be better to use the rating that also includes TMM games in lobbies to help solve the 'kicked greys' issue, among other things.

I like your thinking - I still rarely play global because of some historic rating change in 2013. Being able to develop my global rating with TMM would be great... however it will not work I fear.

In 2013 that change was made because people would deliberately lose 1v1 games in order to get easier global games. That can happen here too, people may want easier global games and could lose TMM games to achieve that.

An additional problem, that affected me, was that 1v1 people got overrated for global. That can happen again to me and others, if you are good at 2v2 you will get a rating that will cause you to lose every global game you join (with shouty teammates and persistent guilt for you).

(unfortunately when they split those ratings up they were not reset, so I still have my overrated global rating from 2013 - but 2 player councillors in a row have informed me it actually is impossible to change)

@valki said in Let's make global rating affected by TMM:

An additional problem, that affected me, was that 1v1 people got overrated for global. That can happen again to me and others, if you are good at 2v2 you will get a rating that will cause you to lose every global game you join (with shouty teammates and persistent guilt for you).

I have mixed feelings about the idea of having 1v1 ladder games affect global rating as I am concerned about that as well. However, 2v2's and beyond shouldn't have that problem to anywhere near as much of an extent as teamwork and the consequences of teamplay are generally still very important in 2v2's. So, having TMM (but not necessarily 1v1 ladder) games affect global rating would be reasonable imo (I'm not saying that it would be perfect, but I think the pros would substantially outweigh the cons).

I don't like 1v1 or 2v2 MM affecting global, but I could get behind 3v3 and 4v4 affecting it.

How would your idea with the custom rating and the universal rating work in practice? For example when hosting a lobby which rating would be displayed? To me it feels like we would basically have the same situation if we changed nothing and people would use the TMM rating to balance the custom games.

Existed in pre-2014, resulted in every dude that wants to chill in sentons/gap to play 10 1v1 games and lose 250 rating “because he had a hard time adjusting” and suddenly you have 10x the smurfing malding.

Not to mention it also has the reverse effect of discouraging playing any matchmaker for those that consider their global their e-penis metric.

If the environments communicate with one another then it needs some sort of restriction in which if global > tmm, then you cannot lose rating. This allows new players to use tmm to get passed the gray period without causing harm elsewhere. Since global is already a garbage implementation of a trueskill environment, who cares that this makes it slightly more garbage.

Problem is there currently doesn’t exist a way for the system to apply a rating change to multiple ratings conditionally like this.

Also zero reason for this to apply to 4v4 but not 1v1 or anything else.

Since this requires some actual implementation work, best “easy system” is just not having a 4v4 tmm rating and using that for global games or making a full share “competitive” tmm with a rating and a share until death “casual” global tmm.

@FtXCommando actually that sounds brilliant/somewhat related to the idea I talked with you about shown rating. But more reasonable/logical.