Make the "Draw Bug" a Bannable Offense

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i'm already talking about it with askaholic, some revert of old pr are gonna be made to fix that.

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Thank you all! Appreciate the hard work!

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I don’t get this thread. What exactly is the problem?

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https://forum.faforever.com/topic/513/a-draw-counted-as-a-win-if-you-kill-enemy-s-acu-with-ctrl-k-of-your-acu?_=1618729696862

Draw bug explained in more details above.
If the ennemy acu is below 2500HP and you ctrl+k, instead of getting a draw you'll get a win.

This is very frustrating for the other player, for a lot of reasons, but mainly :

  • In a normal situation you would try to go for the kill, so the ennemy would have a chance to block you and save his acu. With the bug abuse, once below 2500 and in range of the ennemy acu, it's like being dead, you can just ctrl+k to end the game and still get the win.
  • It's espacially stupid combined with shift+g strategies. You don't need a lot of tanks with your acu to drop your ennemy down to 2500HP. So basically an abuser of this strategy can just rush you with 10 tanks very early and just win ... while in a normal sitaution, this would be a draw.
  • Once both players know about the bug, and you end up in a close acu 1v1 combat, you're always tempted to ctrl+k for the win. So draw situations are never draws anymore.
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In a lot of situations, you actually need to ctrl+K to actually get the draw (e.g. your opponent is <2500hp, but has shift g'd units around your acu and is about to walk out of range), so until the issue is fixed, the best temporary solution is to just pause and ask for/accept a draw in every draw situation.

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In any case, I agree that this problem should be removed. A draw must be fair.

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The last 3 posts have done well to explain, thank you

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https://replay.faforever.com/14351084

Weird case where my opponent ctrl+k and it doesn't bug. Has the bug been fixed or something unexpected happened ?

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@Auricocorico The FAF gods were punishing @Voodoo for not remembering that he could ground-fire his ACU to kill you

(you can stand on the sides of the puddle to shoot into the middle - #14351296)

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I thought it was a valid tactic to ctrl k to kill the enemy com-it stops them gaining vet from killing you and surviving, and from being able to run away from you if they have some spam to block you. I’ve done it myself a number of times and would feel very aggrieved to be banned for it (until now id presumed it would count as a draw). If the actual issue can be fixed then great, but if not it shouldn’t be punishable because it should be a legitimate tactic to obtain a draw instead of a loss. Id be happy with a punishment that just involved a manual rating change as well since that would just be an awkward way of fixing the issue.

One query though-some have suggested pausing and offering a draw. how do you get a draw? One game my opponent had to leave so we agreed to have our coms shoot each other to death to draw; is there a better/easier way?

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You can agree to a draw under the diplomacy tab or w/e it's called in game. It's the same place which can be used to give resources to your allies, offer peace in games with unlocked teams etc.

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Does anyone else remember 'Lame'? I fear to think how highly rated that man would have gotten with drawbug and shift G.

But like actually though, I really don't see this as that much of a problem. It sucks sometimes, but at the end of the day your rating will go back to baseline. Swkoll and I used to offer each other draws if we wanted to be nice, I offered a draw to espi one and he told me to pound salt so I went back to control k'ing if I needed to. I think the situation is too ambiguous to need to start looking at bans or warnings. Everyone knows how sometimes you go for a push and it doesnt work out, and your only chance is to take a draw or lose. I have yet to see anyone really try and abuse the system since "Lame' did this back in 2012-2013.

Also, I thought this got fixed a few days/week ago? The last two games I lost to control K, it counted it as an actual draw?

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a bit late with for the party but that wouldn't be implemented as bannable offense since it's too hard to track down if it was on purpose or not as well as implement a lot of unnecessary fear,imagine some low rated boys that don't know how does that even work,they are going to just stop playing at all if we start banning it,however it is still possible to pm one mods with several replays and go through them,that would probably be better imo,also yeah,i though it was somewhat fixed xD

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Just warn them the first time. You don’t need to ban right away.... I told a guy I was playing against about the bug that plays me frequently, and he stopped using it.

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@tex said in Make the "Draw Bug" a Bannable Offense:

Does anyone else remember 'Lame'? I fear to think how highly rated that man would have gotten with drawbug and shift G.

But like actually though, I really don't see this as that much of a problem. It sucks sometimes, but at the end of the day your rating will go back to baseline. Swkoll and I used to offer each other draws if we wanted to be nice, I offered a draw to espi one and he told me to pound salt so I went back to control k'ing if I needed to. I think the situation is too ambiguous to need to start looking at bans or warnings. Everyone knows how sometimes you go for a push and it doesnt work out, and your only chance is to take a draw or lose. I have yet to see anyone really try and abuse the system since "Lame' did this back in 2012-2013.

Also, I thought this got fixed a few days/week ago? The last two games I lost to control K, it counted it as an actual draw?

No, dude just check some replays lol. Where did you see the update that fixed this?

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For the first two or three years of me playing ladder on FAF, draws always counted as draws and my games always actually counted for rating. Why is it now impossible for these two things to be true at the same time? Just see how the code worked before and do it that way again, maybe it needs to be a special case for ladder1v1 games to avoid the bugs with team games.

I do not think people should be punished in any way for the server interpreting the results of their game wrong. I also don't think moderators should be given more work for some stupid bug that was invented. Everyone should either get used to the bug or get motivated enough to fix it. If we live in a universe where it is impossible to determine who won a 1v1 game even after 14 years of development work, then just embrace the absurdity and hopelessness of the situation and laugh.

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The last two games I played that had a control K draw scenario were rated for me as normal draws, so that's why I thought it got fixed.

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This just sound like a lot of noise for a stupid bug wich issues fix itself by playing more. Fixing the bug should be the unique solution as reviewing replays, sending warnings and applying bans takes time that could be used elsewhere.

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I think drawing a game is fine, if you are lesser rated you should gain points for the draw as you had a lower chance to win (as seen by the bot).

Salvaging a lost game by a draw still requires planning and execution and shows that the opponent wasnt properly defending their acu.

Calling it a bug is misleading as in my view a shortstacking player securing a draw should gain some rating.

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The bug is that a draw counts as a win not that a draw happens. It’s a bug on how the client reports game results to the server.